Need some direction from the experts

[jaywin]

Greeting all,

I am new here and just discovered the satisfaction of kilt wear. I purchased an inexpensive kilt to wear to an Irish festival last week in Dallas. I have wanted to try it out. Several years ago my mother had spent almost a decade researching our genealogy and traced a side of our family to the Duncan Clan. I have joined the Clan Donnachaidh society here in Texas and would like to purchase some good quality kilts to wear. I would like to find:

A. All wool, no PV
B. Made in Scotland
C. Finished with high quality hardware (buckles of high quality and good leather straps)

I am looking to have 3 kilts produced.

1. A dress kilt in Duncan modern tartan
2. A mid-level day wear style in this tartan:
https://dcdalgliesh.co.uk/fabric/445761
3. A casual kilt in a lightweight Duncan ancient. Maybe with a lower rise..

I would greatly appreciate any direction you could provide as searching the web is confusing and frankly from what I've read, you guys would know where to send someone like me. I also am looking for good quality accessories, sporrans, belts etc... A lot of what if seen is pretty cheap, so I'm not looking in the right spots.

Thank you in advance for the advice. JW

[Steve Ashton]

May I suggest you start by contacting those businesses that chose to advertise here.

[Father Bill]

Steve's absolutely right about our advertisers; they're top drawer.

The one thing I'd advise though, is that when it comes to kilts, the best possibility is to work directly with the people who will put the needle through the cloth. Each of them has their own wy of measuring, and you'll have the best resuilts by working with them, letting them order the cloth, etc.

Good luck on your wonderful project!

[McMurdo]

The first thing I would do as Steve rightly says, is go through the vendors on this site. Secondly I would not hold to the idea that the kilt must be made in Scotland, there are many capable kilt makers in North America. Being in Canada I would rather have someone from either Canada or the US sew up my kilts it just saves on import duties, in fact for me the best kilt maker in the world is Barb Tewksbury from upstate New York, who co wrote The Art of Kiltmaking.

So lets go through the various pieces needed to put together an outfit:
Hose:
As for kilt hose I would say for mass produced kilt hose The House of Cheviot would be the way to go, these can be had through many vendors.
https://www.houseofcheviot.com/highland-hose

Sporrans:
As you say can be had as you say rather cheaply, if it were me I would again look for quality, L&M Sporrans, and Margaret Morrison are two makers that come to mind. You could also try to find a vintage sporran, that has worked for me in the past.
http://morrison-sporrans.co.uk/
https://www.landmhighland.ca/products-page/sporrans/

Jackets:
I recently had a tartan jacket and waistcoat made up for me by a local tartan shop and think that honestly if your pocketbook can warrant it that bespoke is the way to go. Most new jackets no matter the vendor are constructed by the same company, simply having different labels sewn in. Again I have had some luck finding vintage kilt jackets on eBay, at local tartan shops and in the for sale section of this forum. Another idea is that going to a tartan shop that offers rental jackets often have ex-rental sales. I purchased my charcoal grey argyll and waistcoat that way and it had never been rented out, so was in fact a brand new set.

Those pieces will get you through most occasions as for shirts, shoes, and ties using what you have already.

If you feel you need a sgian dubh, I would stay away from anything mass produced as they are simply polymer handles and cheap metal blades, instead look for a handmade sgian dubh from a reputable maker. I say this as I wasted a bit of money on cheap sgian dubh's over the years and was recently gifted a sgian that my girlfriend's grandfather made, it is a quality piece that has become the only sgian dubh I use.

[Tobus]

I am looking to have 3 kilts produced.

1. A dress kilt in Duncan modern tartan
2. A mid-level day wear style in this tartan:
https://dcdalgliesh.co.uk/fabric/445761
3. A casual kilt in a lightweight Duncan ancient. Maybe with a lower rise..

Honestly, I think the first two on your list could be the same kilt. There's no such thing as a "dress kilt". A full 8-yard kilt of proper wool tartan cloth serves well for both dress/formal occasions as well as everyday casual wear to daywear. You'll find that a well-made traditional kilt is quite versatile.

I started off with a lightweight "casual kilt", then moved on to various traditional full-yardage kilts, lighter box-pleat kilts, etc. But I really don't wear the lighter casual-style kilts any more. When I feel the need to strap on a kilt, I always gravitate towards the "real deal".

And I agree with others - the "made in Scotland" requirement is not going to give you any benefit. Oddly enough, the best quality kilt I own was made in the USA, and the one that I had the most problems with in terms of quality and construction was made in Scotland.

[jaywin]

Great advice everyone and thank you. I have sent an email to Barbara and am waiting on a response. I also appreciate the links for the accessories!

Thank you very much! JW

[Jock Scot]

Good advice has been given and I really cannot add much more. I would though, draw your attention to Steve's very pertinent post(69) in the "white sock" thread that is currently a hot topic. Nevertheless do your research, ask questions, research some more and then ask more questions. After that when you are ready, buy once and buy the best that you can afford, it will be less expensive that way!

[Taskr]

Having had the benefit of advice from this forum (and continue to) I can attest that you've come to the right place.

I agree that good kilt/casual kilt is not necessarily a distinction. Find the 1 kilt 10 looks thread and you will see that even a 16oz tank can be every bit as casual as a PV machine sewn - but not necessarily the reverse. I also agree that if possible, meet your kilt maker face to face (even via Skype of Face Time) to ensure measure for fit. Made in Scotland is not so important. There is nothing wrong at all with mail order from the UK (I have two because of the way the projects came together), but there is something about the one from the shop I actually stood in that makes the fit that bit better - and not at a cost either. On a visit to Freedom Kilts I had myself measured for file for the day I have the pleasure of asking them making a kilt for me. As for the sporran, they are available through vendors here also. Some of us even make our own (see DIY threads)

The better advice I received was to take my time and not rush to get everything all at once. I got a few basics and then let my cumulatively acquired kilt style and tastes guide me along - with a touch back to Xmarks along the way. I also remembered what many years ago a mentor told me; that those of us without much money can't afford to buy cheap things. I've learned that is very true. Quality at a good value price wears and retains far, far longer than the cheap things we end up having to replace. Finding it at a discount price is even better!

Happy kilting!

[The Wizard of BC]

I would like to add one more thing to the advice you have been given so far.

All and I mean all, traditional kilts are designed to fit at the anatomical waist. This is quite high on the body. Right up under the ribs. If the kilt is made in accordance with "The Art of Kiltmaking" there is then 2 inches of kilt above the top straps. This is called the 'rise' and actually goes up over the ribs in the back.

Unless you have a kilt that is designed and cut to ride lower from the start you cannot wear a traditional kilt lower. The hem will fall below the top of the kneecap and in the back the portion that is sewn down and tapered (Called the Fell) will end below the crest of the hips and buttocks. This has a tendency to cause large shower curtain folds in the back of the kilt.

You can go to any event where kilts are being worn and see guys trying to wear a kilt made to fit at full rise lower. You will see just the sort of things I have just described.

As far as I know there are only a handful of kiltmakers who can or will cut a kilt to ride lower. This way of wearing a kilt is usually found only on the modern style (usually solid colored fabrics) kilts.

The bottom pencil in this photo is pointing at my navel. The top pencil is pointing at the bottom of my breastbone.
Can you see in the small of the back how the kilt actually flares outward to go up over the short ribs?





Almost any kilt that you order over a website will not be cut to be worn lower. So the kilt you want to wear that way is going to be harder to find and will usually be a custom job.

I would also not discount the 65% Polyester / 35% Rayon blend fabric known as P/V. The term P/V is used a lot by the imported kilts to mean any synthetic but in reality true P/V is a very good fabric for a kilt that will be worn casually. It is totally machine washable and dryable. Once the pleat creases are set properly they are almost permanent. The fabric is very wrinkle resistant and is teflon coated to resist spills.
All of my rental kilts are made from Marton Mills true P/V. It is a miracle fabric. I can easily wear a well made P/V kilt and from 5 feet away most people cannot tell it is not a full wool traditional kilt.

This is an example of a well made P/V kilt designed from the start to be worn lower.

[jaywin]

This is great info. Thank you STEVE!

I would like to add one more thing to the advice you have been given so far.

All and I mean all, traditional kilts are designed to fit at the anatomical waist. This is quite high on the body. Right up under the ribs. If the kilt is made in accordance with "The Art of Kiltmaking" there is then 2 inches of kilt above the top straps. This is called the 'rise' and actually goes up over the ribs in the back.

Unless you have a kilt that is designed and cut to ride lower from the start you cannot wear a traditional kilt lower. The hem will fall below the top of the kneecap and in the back the portion that is sewn down and tapered (Called the Fell) will end below the crest of the hips and buttocks. This has a tendency to cause large shower curtain folds in the back of the kilt.

You can go to any event where kilts are being worn and see guys trying to wear a kilt made to fit at full rise lower. You will see just the sort of things I have just described.

As far as I know there are only a handful of kiltmakers who can or will cut a kilt to ride lower. This way of wearing a kilt is usually found only on the modern style (usually solid colored fabrics) kilts.

The bottom pencil in this photo is pointing at my navel. The top pencil is pointing at the bottom of my breastbone.
Can you see in the small of the back how the kilt actually flares outward to go up over the short ribs?





Almost any kilt that you order over a website will not be cut to be worn lower. So the kilt you want to wear that way is going to be harder to find and will usually be a custom job.

I would also not discount the 65% Polyester / 35% Rayon blend fabric known as P/V. The term P/V is used a lot by the imported kilts to mean any synthetic but in reality true P/V is a very good fabric for a kilt that will be worn casually. It is totally machine washable and dryable. Once the pleat creases are set properly they are almost permanent. The fabric is very wrinkle resistant and is teflon coated to resist spills.
All of my rental kilts are made from Marton Mills true P/V. It is a miracle fabric. I can easily wear a well made P/V kilt and from 5 feet away most people cannot tell it is not a full wool traditional kilt.

This is an example of a well made P/V kilt designed from the start to be worn lower.