White Tie

[HeeHeeHeeHaw]

I am aware that there is a good chance that I will literally never attend a white tie event aside from weddings however however what would classify as "white tie" other than a PC, and would an Argyle be taboo?

[Macman]

My understanding is that the Argyle is taboo, and that the Prince Charlie would not be worn as white tie by many. I own a PC, but if I was invited to a white tie event (not likely to happen) I would decline the invitation.

[MurrayInGA]

Id say, particularly in the US, you could get away with an Argyll at a black-tie event but a PC would be required at a white-tie.

[Father Bill]

My understanding is that the Argyle is taboo, and that the Prince Charlie would not be worn as white tie by many. I own a PC, but if I was invited to a white tie event (not likely to happen) I would decline the invitation.

Why on earth would you decline? I don't imagine you're being uppity, so . . . .

[kilted2000]

If you want to know what is traditional for white tie, this thread might help. https://www.xmarksthescot.com/forum/...xamples-85511/

[Troglodyte]

As they say, the clue is in the title.

For a white tie event, a white tie is worn - that is, a white bow-tie in an appropriate material (marcella is always a favourite) with a standing wing-collar shirt (with collar and bib-front to match the tie, so marcella in this case) and a white waistcoat (again marcella is good).

With English (call it Saxon if you wish) evening-dress styles, the white- or black-tie events follow English dress codes, and the style of coat and trousers is strict. White-tie equivalent in Highland dress is just as strict (despite what some people say, actually wear, and get away with) and ought properly to be observed.

With either the kilt or trews, it is what is worn above the waist that is important, but those in Highland dress have more option and variety of choice, than dull evening-tails.

An Argyle jacket is day-wear, pure and simple, and not proper evening-wear at all - despite what some people will tell you. So avoid this unless you want to lay yourself open to criticism.

If you have a Prince Charlie doublet, you can quite happily and properly wear this, as it resembles a smartened-up evening tail-coat in both cut and style. Only, remember the white tie, waistcoat and wing-collar shirt. This is perfectly correct and proper with both kilt and trews. But remember, never a black waistcoat with white-tie - that's strictly the preserve of the head-waiter in a hotel.

Where Highland dress has the advantage is in its alternative options - being the doublets such at the Sheriffmuir, Kenmore and Montrose. These are intended to be worn with a lace jabot (archaic, it is true, but dashingly smart and romantic) and lace cuffs if you like, too.

It should be remembered that the difference between a black-tie and white-tie styles, is that black-tie is for informal (do not confuse formality with smartness) events (dining at home or out with friends), and white-tie for formal events at a venue. Both are evening-dress (the clothes you change into after a day's toil or activity, and it is done to show you have both self-respect and respect for your fellow man) and the event organiser will choose which depending on their intentions.

Refusing an invitation because of the dress-code, is a huge insult to your would-be host - and shows your contempt for those who are quite happy to dress-up for an evening and enter into the spirit of the thing. Not only do you not show yourself to be 'above such trivialities' as some try to fool themselves, but you mark yourself out as 'not the right sort' at all. A cad, a bounder.

Dressing-up for any kind of event adds something to the occasion (which is why we do it), and is all part of the fun. Being unused to wearing the styles wears off instantly, once you arrive at the event and you find all the other guests dressed similarly - like being in uniform, or team colours.

Feeling self-conscious at being dressed-up is due to habitude (being unused to it), and the trick is to relax and move normally - and avoid tugging at you collar and complaining of feeling like a penguin. You see that in movies for theatrical effect and is an old cliche.

You will find that no matter how well or badly dressed you think yourself, there will always be someone better or worse turned-out. But no-one really cares, as it is all about joining-in.

But, most important, remember the lady who is with you - the last thing she wants after having gone through the shampoo, set and make-up routine to look her stunning best, is for her man to spoil the evening with his selfish inverted vanity, complaining and fidgetting.

The best advice is probably enter into the spirit of the event completely, and see it as fun - for that's all it is ever intended to be.

The pictures show how the old catalogues thought it ought to be done, and even suggest a coloured waistcoat so you can please yourself. These styles are as true today as they were 100 years ago.

It's such a pity we see so few white-tie events these days...

[figheadair]

As they say, the clue is in the title.

For a white tie event, a white tie is worn - that is, a white bow-tie in an appropriate material (marcella is always a favourite) with a standing wing-collar shirt (with collar and bib-front to match the tie, so marcella in this case) and a white waistcoat (again marcella is good).

An excellent overview. I am fortunate to have an opportunity to attend 2-3 White tie events annually. This was last October. Doublet, Marcella shirt and tie, goat-hair sporran and diced hose. Travelling shoes for getting across London before changing into Buckle Brogues.

[Troglodyte]

An excellent overview. I am fortunate to have an opportunity to attend 2-3 White tie events annually. This was last October. Doublet, Marcella shirt and tie, goat-hair sporran and diced hose. Travelling shoes for getting across London before changing into Buckle Brogues.

Faultless..!

The quintessential example of how white-tie is done with Highand dress - miles more attractive and stylish than the monochrome Lowland English variant.

We need more white-tie events, I say.

[Macman]

Why on earth would you decline? I don't imagine you're being uppity, so . . . .

Not uppity, Bill. I would be honoured to receive an invitation to a white-tie event. It's just that I would feel underdressed in a PC. I can't remember where I read that a PC was for black, not white tie - probably a book or article from fifty years ago. Now, if I owned a Sheriffmuir or a regulation doublet with jabot . . .

[Troglodyte]

The main thing we need to remember with different dress codes, is that they are there for the guidance of guests as well as the host fot getting the event off on the desired level of smartness and formality.

They are certainly not a filter to catch out and remove anyone.

The principal behind all social codes is to get everyone working together, dressing in the conventional way and generally entering into the spirit (ie, having fun) of the occasion.

Refusing to wear white-tie, or even to go to such an event, is the same as refusing to wear your team's strip when playing football, or refusing to play if team colours are required. You deny yourself any amount of fun and pleasure, and no-one thinks your 'principles' anything but silly.

Most of life is a play-act, and our daily clothes are mostly a tribal costume to display which tribe we happen to identify with. So, with dress-codes for social events, it is an understandable mistake to confuse or equate the likes of white-tie etiquette as something to do with class or status.

In fact, the opposite is true - the codes are there to protect everyone with a kind of uniform style that hides any discrepancy between guests' financial or social status.

What is frequently seen nowadays is a curious mix of old and new, where a man's finances might require him to wear old and battered evening clothes that once belonged to his grandfather, while better-off others at the same event will be cutting a very sharp dash in perfetly form-fitting newly and expensively made duds.

So what..?

Well, the answer is that is matters not the least - as everyone is playing the game according to his means and abillity. Class or social status, or financial means, are irrelevant. No-one cares.

What matters is that you have accepted the invitation, dressed accordingly and entered into the spirit of the thing - with the intention of having fun, which is probably the best compliment you can give your host.

Highland dress adds a bright dash of colour to any evening event - both black- and white-tie - so why would you deny yourself the opportunity to whoop-it-up once in a while?

If you think you wouldn't get the use out of owning white-tie kit to make it worth while, the hire companies are there for you. Their stock is changed regularly, and you may be given new and unworn items. There's no shame to hiring.