Homespun "Historic" Great Kilt tartan?

[SandSailor'00]

My wife and I are considering some "historic" Highland attire from upcoming games. Usually, we wear our "official" tartans...I wear a MacPherson red tartan, usually in semi-formal "day" wear with tweed Argyle (see below)...she wears a Stewart in a smart, "hostess" length skirt.



What we're aiming for this time around, is something more or less of the early 18th century, prior to the Anglo influence of "official" clan tartans. I'm planning a "great kilt" with leather doublet, and she's planning a period dress in a matching tartan...with (completely for the fun of it) a toddler sized kilt for our son.


The first problem I came across was, inevitably, cost..."Authentic" hand woven, 100% wool tartan fabric from Scotland is running close to $60-$90 per yard, and ready made garments are running around $300-$500 per. As the wife and I are experienced crafters...and she, a talented seamstress...we decided to stick with our own product, and find a tartan of more economical material, that still "looked right", and in a pattern that while not "authentic", didn't stand out like a sore thumb on a cold day.

After a lengthy search...and consultation with the wife, we landed on this pattern:



As it is 100% cotton, "homespun", it lacks the knapp of wool...but has the "handmade/period" look, and at a couple bucks a yard...I was able to get enough yardage to double up the thickness for the great kilt.

Here are my only real concerns...and I'd be grateful for feedback in regard to any "faux pas" we might commit with this pattern:

1. The pattern is small...about half the size of "authentic" tartan. I've researched "ancient" patterns, and have found a wide range of variety...from very colorful patterns to almost solid...but nothing that essentially "looks" like a modern tartan, only in a smaller grouping. Has anyone information/opinions on the smaller set?

2. The great thing about heavy wool is that it "hangs" right...while this "homespun" fabric doesn't have much "give", and I've enough to make ample room for the pleats (I intend to hand fold)...I'm curious if anyone has worn cotton tartan, and what the potential concerns might be?

3. Obviously, when folding the pleats, the smaller pattern will result in about twice the pleats, at half the width...I tested this out, and it still looks "good", but again...just wondering if there are "tartan police" out there who might take issue.

Thanks,

Dizzy

[figheadair]

What we're aiming for this time around, is something more or less of the early 18th century, prior to the Anglo influence of "official" clan tartans. I'm planning a "great kilt" with leather doublet, and she's planning a period dress in a matching tartan...with (completely for the fun of it) a toddler sized kilt for our son.

The first problem I came across was, inevitably, cost..."Authentic" hand woven, 100% wool tartan fabric from Scotland is running close to $60-$90 per yard, and ready made garments are running around $300-$500 per. As the wife and I are experienced crafters...and she, a talented seamstress...we decided to stick with our own product, and find a tartan of more economical material, that still "looked right", and in a pattern that while not "authentic", didn't stand out like a sore thumb on a cold day.

After a lengthy search...and consultation with the wife, we landed on this pattern:



As it is 100% cotton, "homespun", it lacks the knapp of wool...but has the "handmade/period" look, and at a couple bucks a yard...I was able to get enough yardage to double up the thickness for the great kilt.

Here are my only real concerns...and I'd be grateful for feedback in regard to any "faux pas" we might commit with this pattern:

1. The pattern is small...about half the size of "authentic" tartan. I've researched "ancient" patterns, and have found a wide range of variety...from very colorful patterns to almost solid...but nothing that essentially "looks" like a modern tartan, only in a smaller grouping. Has anyone information/opinions on the smaller set?

2. The great thing about heavy wool is that it "hangs" right...while this "homespun" fabric doesn't have much "give", and I've enough to make ample room for the pleats (I intend to hand fold)...I'm curious if anyone has worn cotton tartan, and what the potential concerns might be?

3. Obviously, when folding the pleats, the smaller pattern will result in about twice the pleats, at half the width...I tested this out, and it still looks "good", but again...just wondering if there are "tartan police" out there who might take issue.

Thanks,

Dizzy

Apologies if what follows appears overly negative but if you want to replicate, in any sort of approximate fashion, early 18th century tartan then cotton just won't do I'm afraid.

Having hand-woven for many years, and been a cast of one, I'd be amazed if you were able to find hand-woven cloth in Scotland at any price, let alone $60-90 p/y.

With regard to your specific questions:

1. Plaids of the first half of the 18th century were always made from two lengths of single width cloth, usually with the pattern off-set and often with a selvedge mark or pattern (not the same thing). Such patterns were generally large setts but you could get away with your proposal although it will look very busy.

2. See my comment about historical the use of wool vs. cotton.

3. First and foremost, the are no Tartan Police, although some people seem to think that they are some sort of self-appointed judge and jury.

The bottom line here is that to 'do' early 18th century means using none clan tartan in wool. Unfortunately the very limited availability is directly related to the higher price, if you can find it. I suspect that you are therefore going to have to make a major compromise and therefore whatever you choose will bb, by necessity thematic and not historically accurate.

[SandSailor'00]

Not taken as "negative" in the least...very detailed information, and exactly the quality of opinion I'm looking for.

I have my doubts about the cotton as well (not really wasted material, as the wife has a business producing ladies and kids clothing...so it will be used, one way or 'tother).

[Downunder Kilt]

Have a look at Celtic Croft. Their homespun andsynthetic /wool or PV selections of tartan maybe something to consider.
Cheers

[Manxstralian]

http://wooltartan.com/discount-tartans/

This page has a few double width wool tartans for $25 (Canadian) per metre. I've read somewhere here that they aren't suitable for kilts as they don't take a pleat very well, but it may suit your needs.

Cheers,
Cameron

[figheadair]

Merino wool - better than cotton but definitley not ideal compared with cloth woven from a cross-bred worsted yarn.

[Panache]

Dizzy,

You mentioned a leather doublet as part of you proposed outfit. While there are some really neat ones out there (I'm thinking of Ravenswood Leather and Pendragon on the Renaissance Faire circuit) I'm not sure leather is particularly historically accurate. I mention this because you are taking such care in looking for the right tartan material for your great kilt. I wear a belted plaid to our local Ren Faire each year (because it is fun even though it is in no way appropriate for the late 16th Century)

To show you the difference

Here is my outfit with a leather doublet (Ren Faire / fantasy)



Here is my friend Dale with a wool jacket (historically correct 18th Century)



(I hope Dale doesn't mind that I borrowed his photo)

Cheers

Jamie

PS: Yes, that is the same sword in both photos

[Alan H]

When I assembled a great kilt for Ren Faire I wound up watching ebay for a long time...many weeks. I finally found a reasonable-weight wool tartan done up in colors that would have actually existed in the 1700's, though I doubt that woad ( a rather shocking blue) would have been all that popular at the time.

Upshot is that after many discussions with the local Guilds, I finally came to understand that really and truly, they don't care that much about historical accuracy. They want it to be "sort of accurate" and more important "what the patrons expect". It took me a while to come 'round to that way of thinking but I accept it now. So in fact my getup looks rather like Panache's, up above, just a different color combination. It's not even vaguely accurate for the 1500's, and even less so for the 1700's.


Anyway, I would suggest using the cotton that you bought for tableware or something and just watching ebay with care for however long it takes to acquire a length of "old-looking" wool tartan. Wool with some weight to it really will do a lot better than lightweight cotton.

[Liam]

Merino wool - better than cotton but definitley not ideal compared with cloth woven from a cross-bred worsted yarn.

I have a kilt made from merino wool from TK textiles, formerly Fraser and Kirkbright. It isn't the same but it is one of my most comfortable kilts to wear. It is also lighter in weight 12 oz, so would be far more comfortable for most ren faire situations I would think.

[SandSailor'00]

Gents-

So, after assembling all the much appreciated advice, my wife and I did visit the Celtic Croft, and ended up with "Brown Watch" tartan in the form of a great kilt and Arisaid...plus a yard extra to make the wee one some kit. Not strictly "historic"...but the examples they offered did have ties to other clans, and we decided if it wasn't "our" clans...neutral was best.

I've also researched more regarding the period, and was fortunate that some of my 18th century sailing kit was pretty much perfect: I've a short, dark blue wool jacket reproduced from an early-mid 1700s example, a green and weathered waistcoat of the period, and am making "bag hose" to complete the look. I'm not a bad leather worker, and one evening and two beers produced a nice "rustic" sporran with wooden button.

I chose the black wool bonnet of the period, and keeping that as simple as possible.

Footwear...I own a well weathered pair of Fugawees, but might go for the "mogan" look, or something simpler.

Pics will follow later.