Outlander, s'more

[freep]

http://www.frockflicks.com/the-real-...nder-costumes/

[NPG]

I've seen this article before, I found it rather interesting. I especially agree that the tartans are all too modern and dark/colorless. Though this seems to be hollywood's problem with history as other shows like Vikings suffer from this problem too. We seem to collectively want to imagine the past in drab dark colors, but I digress as I could write an entire paper on that subject.

The one thing that I gripe with in this article is that it seems to place the onus of the decline of the Highland way of life to the Acts of Proscription, which is debatable both in the impact that the Acts had as well as them being the sole cause of decline. The Statutes of Iona from 1609 played a role in this as well. It certainly distanced some of the Highland Leadership from their people and traditions by forcing them to attending Protestant English-Speaking Lowland Schools. As well as the outlawing of bards.

Overall I've been pleasantly surprised by Outlander and it's depiction, a show my fiancée talked me into watching.

[Cavalry Scout]

I watched episode 1 of the first season on a whim, and have turned into an Outlander junkie, LOL.

Cheers, Mark

[freep]

I've seen this article before, I found it rather interesting. I especially agree that the tartans are all too modern and dark/colorless. Though this seems to be hollywood's problem with history as other shows like Vikings suffer from this problem too. We seem to collectively want to imagine the past in drab dark colors, but I digress as I could write an entire paper on that subject.

The one thing that I gripe with in this article is that it seems to place the onus of the decline of the Highland way of life to the Acts of Proscription, which is debatable both in the impact that the Acts had as well as them being the sole cause of decline. The Statutes of Iona from 1609 played a role in this as well. It certainly distanced some of the Highland Leadership from their people and traditions by forcing them to attending Protestant English-Speaking Lowland Schools. As well as the outlawing of bards.

Overall I've been pleasantly surprised by Outlander and it's depiction, a show my fiancée talked me into watching.

I think one of the mistakes we make in the study of history and particularly the appearance and practices of our distance ancestors it to assume that everyone of a period acted like and wore the same clothes as those mentioned in original documents. Generally descriptions of people tended toward those of the nobility and commoners were rarely described. Thus, the tartans worn by the crofters and tacksmen of the clans were probably not particularly bright if only because pre-aniline dyes faded quite quickly. The gentry would have been able to afford new when the fading set in.

[NPG]

I think one of the mistakes we make in the study of history and particularly the appearance and practices of our distance ancestors it to assume that everyone of a period acted like and wore the same clothes as those mentioned in original documents. Generally descriptions of people tended toward those of the nobility and commoners were rarely described. Thus, the tartans worn by the crofters and tacksmen of the clans were probably not particularly bright if only because pre-aniline dyes faded quite quickly. The gentry would have been able to afford new when the fading set in.

That is a good point, and one the article touches on to a degree in the idea of "you get the colors you pay for". So I guess the color issue is more about not having much variety between the clan rank and file and the clan leadership when it comes to tartans. Maybe when the show gets to Culloden they will have a bit more diversity as Bonnie Prince Charlie is always depicted in bright colors.

[figheadair]

I think one of the mistakes we make in the study of history and particularly the appearance and practices of our distance ancestors it to assume that everyone of a period acted like and wore the same clothes as those mentioned in original documents. Generally descriptions of people tended toward those of the nobility and commoners were rarely described. Thus, the tartans worn by the crofters and tacksmen of the clans were probably not particularly bright if only because pre-aniline dyes faded quite quickly. The gentry would have been able to afford new when the fading set in.

Sorry freep but that's too simplistic a division and just not the case with regard to some dyes such as indigio. Analine dyes also fade, they just do it differently to the way natural dyes do.

[freep]

Sorry freep but that's too simplistic a division and just not the case with regard to some dyes such as indigio. Analine dyes also fade, they just do it differently to the way natural dyes do.

It used to be that when movies were made they didn't by and large give a tinker's damn for anything remotely close to historical authenticity regarding wardrobe, social history aspects such as housing, cooking, other crafts and clothing. Witness another thread here regarding "Stetson" hats--a common term for any cowboy style hat resulting from decades of Hollywood depictions of the American west. The same phenomenon exists regarding every genre of historical film and extends even to recent films, "Braveheart" coming to mind.

My point is there is a movement that is slowly trying to introduce a more accurate degree of historicity in film. Examples would include "Dances With Wolves," "Rob Roy," and now "Outlander." This is not to say those movies and others are exact representations of the period depicted but rather vast improvements over previous efforts.

As to tartan the ancient and weathered versions of various Clan tartans are an avowed attempt to match what tartan would have looked like before the creation of modern dyes and alternative fabrics. If there is a discrepancy in the tartans used for recent movies, at least they are going too far in the right direction, perhaps.

So, as regards details such as this I applaud the attempt to depict something accurately. Where criticism is warranted perhaps we should approach it with a degree of circumspection rather than to focus entirely on mistakes without kudos for what they've done correctly or at least closer than they have in the past.

[figheadair]

As to tartan the ancient and weathered versions of various Clan tartans are an avowed attempt to match what tartan would have looked like before the creation of modern dyes and alternative fabrics.

Indeed, but my point is that these colour ranges don't represent the use of pre-aniline dyes in tartan. Apart from the fact that almost any shade is available from natural dyes, my main gripe with modern tartans (woven not shades) is that they work with uniform palettes; light, dark, muted etc., which is not how dyes were used in 18th century tartans. As a guide to pre-Culloden era tartans: red of any shade, from pink to claret, was good; blue was invariably a dark navy; green was generally a moss shade but occasionally was very dark, like the shade in modern colours.

[freep]

Sorry freep but that's too simplistic a division and just not the case with regard to some dyes such as indigio. Analine dyes also fade, they just do it differently to the way natural dyes do.

I bow to your superior knowledge regarding dyes and the relative, erm, "fade-ability" thereof.

I do stand by the presumption that crofters and tacksmen would not have worn clothes as expensive as did the upper classes. Moreover, the lower classes would not be able to buy new clothing as often. This combined with spending in all likelihood far more time outdoors than would the gentry would mean more fading of less permanently dyed fabric, no?

[freep]

I've been a bit distracted and busy for the last few weeks--I married off my daughter last Saturday--and have finally found the time to re-read http://www.frockflicks.com/the-real-...nder-costumes/ and one of the things that struck me is the following:

"And quite frankly, I love the subtle rebellion against the popular misconceptions that Ms. Dresbach and her team snuck in in the form of different, if subtle tartans; the mixture of trews with kilts, etc. It shows that they know their research, know what the audience wants, but are still quietly going to get as much historical accuracy as Hollywood will allow in where they can."