Dirk style kilt pin - antique or not?

**Tobus** · 12th October 15, 05:38 AM

My wife bought this at an estate auction yesterday. They were calling it a Victorian brooch, and apparently she was the only one at the auction who knew it was a kilt pin. She had the good sense to keep that info to herself until she had won the bid, and only paid $37.50 for it. The estate was of an elderly couple, and I didn't get the sense that there were any other kilt-related items in the estate. So they may have bought it long ago thinking it was just a brooch or pin, not knowing it was specific to kilts or Scotland or anything like that. This would suggest (to me, anyway) that it isn't a modern knock-off or replica that seems to be commonly sold to kilt-wearers. But I could be wrong.

Those of you who may be knowledgeable in such things, help a brother out! Does this appear to be a genuine antique kilt pin, or a modern replica? I couldn't find any hallmarks on it during my brief inspection last night, but I may not know where to look. The only marks I see on it are the words "HOLD-ON" stamped in the brass keeper on the pin shaft.

It appears to have quite a selection of stones. Would that be cairngorm at the top of the dirk and at the little utensils? I assume it's agate in the main body. But I'm not very educated on stones or jewels. The detail work in the silver appears to be well-done, by hand, and not a cheap hack job, but again, I'm not well versed in such things. Give me your impressions of the quality, if you think it might be pertinent to determining its authenticity.

*edit: for some reason, my attachments won't show up. I'm posting them from Photobucket...

**Bluescelt** · 12th October 15, 06:58 AM

Tobus, It looks well made from the photos and seems to have a bit of patina. From what I have seen in reproduction pieces the detail in the metal work, the cut of the stones and the fit between the two are usually shoddy. On your piece even up close the fit looks good and there is nice detail in the metal. It may be Victorian but one would think there should be a hallmark if it is silver. For the price it is a beautiful piece. You won't have the fear of damaging it if worn. Wear it and enjoy it. Good find!

**ShaunMaxwell** · 12th October 15, 07:02 AM

Hey Toby:

Like you, I have no knowledge of antique jewelry/stones, but there are several things about the pin which seem very similar to a pin my wife gave me for Christmas a few years ago. She purchased it from a vendor at the Salado event. I noticed that they had a glassed case on display of "antique" pieces, and I admired this piece, but didn't make the purchase. My wife, apparently, witnessed this and went back later and purchased it.

It was billed as a silver Victorian pin, but I find no hallmarks on it either. The detail work in the silver and the stones (which are agates, I suspect – apart from the cairngorm) seems very similar to yours. I think it's likely that both pieces are antiques.

I'll follow this thread with interest as folks more knowledgeable weigh in.

I suspect that your wife likely got a good price on a nice pin!

SM

**ShaunMaxwell** · 12th October 15, 07:14 AM

A quick search of the internet provided these examples, which seem very similar to yours:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ANTIQUE-SCOT...-/141549452284

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Antique-Scot...-/252114148026

http://www.nalfie.com/product/scotti.../#.VhvBdPlVhHw

I also found one that's very similar to mine:

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/ANTIQUE-SCOTT...-/291480721133

**Tobus** · 12th October 15, 07:57 AM

Originally Posted by ShaunMaxwell

Hey Toby:

Like you, I have no knowledge of antique jewelry/stones, but there are several things about the pin which seem very similar to a pin my wife gave me for Christmas a few years ago. She purchased it from a vendor at the Salado event. I noticed that they had a glassed case on display of "antique" pieces, and I admired this piece, but didn't make the purchase. My wife, apparently, witnessed this and went back later and purchased it.

It was billed as a silver Victorian pin, but I find no hallmarks on it either. The detail work in the silver and the stones (which are agates, I suspect – apart from the cairngorm) seems very similar to yours. I think it's likely that both pieces are antiques.

Yeah, Shaun, we have drooled over that vendor's antique pins several times. Looking at his antique pins is why Kelly immediately recognised this pin for what it is, and led her to feel like she got quite a steal at the auction. Of course, now we're in the research phase to see if it really is genuine.

This one is a little "blingy" for my tastes, so I'm not yet sure whether to keep this or sell it. Even if we do decide to sell it, I'm not sure her local antique mall booth is the best place to move something like this. The local yokels obviously don't recognise or appreciate things like this.

I might actually bring this pin to Salado next month and see if that vendor has any thoughts on it. At the very least, I want to take another hard look at what he has in his case and check out the details for comparison.

**Finistere** · 12th October 15, 08:54 AM

I might be totally off track here, but how do you fit it to a kilt with that brass/bronze turned piece in the middle of the securing pin? Kit

**Dughlas mor** · 12th October 15, 09:42 AM

That is a very nice piece of work, whether it is antique or not. I would have to guess that it is. Nice score!

**Tobus** · 12th October 15, 10:23 AM

Originally Posted by Finistere

I might be totally off track here, but how do you fit it to a kilt with that brass/bronze turned piece in the middle of the securing pin? Kit

It slips off the pin. The idea is that you take it off, run the pin through the front of the kilt apron, then install the keeper on the pin, then run the pin back through the apron to the front side and latch it to the main body. The keeper remains on the "back side" of the cloth. It has an internal locking mechanism that allows it to sort of clamp on to the pin, so that if the pin comes unlatched, the keeper won't let it fall out. The keeper is assisted by some very light scoring of the pin shaft in a diagonal cross-hatch pattern, which is faintly visible in the photos. You pull on the round knobby end of the keeper to release its grip from the pin shaft. I was playing with it last night, and it's a very effective way to prevent the loss of a nice kilt pin in the event of an unlatching from the bottom.

*edited to add: I'm calling it a keeper, but I believe it's commonly known as a "stick pin clutch". These were commonly used when pins and brooches were more popular.

**Finistere** · 12th October 15, 10:44 AM

Ahh, Thank you Tobus for the education, I've been looking on the net and the one's I'm finding which have the same or similar design are from the 1880s, and they are not hallmarked to, you've got a bargain pin with a lot of age, as you know I don't Kilt pin, but somebody that does its a beauty. Kit

**Tobus** · 12th October 15, 10:52 AM

More pieces to the puzzle: apparently the fellow whose estate this came from was a retired Navy man. I suppose it might be possible that he bought this as a gift for his wife while on shore leave in Scotland. That could perhaps explain how this distinctive Highland piece could end up in a household with no other signs pointing to Scottish ties.