Sporran étiqueté

[Hamish Ramsay]

Having inherited / discovered in trunk in back room a very nice horse hair two tasseled Sporran I was considering keeping it or "formal occasions" such as our daughters wedding next year, only. I have read with interest however some posts here and also other articles that this type o Sporran is usually only associated with military / pipers. For that reason I am caused to think again about my utilisation of said sporran for anything other than in the display cabinet.

I would very much doubt that any attendees to the wedding would have the faintest idea about sporrans however I am a traditionalist and do not want to make light of such an item.

Any thoughts / input from the group on this would be appreciated

[Tomo]

Perhaps more of a modern convention.

Having read your previous post, this type of sporran would have been appropriate for the period of the rest of the outfit.

Some would still quite happily sport such a sporran. Esp. outside Scotland. If you're happy with it, wear it with pride - chances are v.few (if any) of the wedding guests would question your choice - and if they do you have a tale tell.

[Panache]

Historically horsehair sporrans were not just for pipers and the military.

Nowadays it is more common for them to be worn as such.

I have one and sometimes wear it, because sometimes it seems like just the right special occasion.

Hopefully OC Richard will weigh in as he is our Sporran Expert here on XMTS

Cheers

Jamie

[figheadair]

Just Google Victorian kilt outfits - the majority of the sporran will be horse-hair.

[kilted2000]

I would have thought that the traditional thing to do, if some Scottish laird or someone had inherited such a sporran, would be to wear it with pride.

[McMurdo]

I have a horsehair sporran, from 1911 and wear it on Black or White tie occasions. Here are some photos to show what I mean. If I'm wearing tweed the only time I would wear it is when I'm wearing my Argyll and waistcoat from 1894 as they are from about the same time period.

Black Tie:


White Tie, Doublet is also from 1911:


With Tweed, jacket and waistcoat from 1894 and kilt hose are in the Gairloch pattern from 1847:

[OC Richard]

Having inherited/discovered in trunk in back room a very nice horsehair Sporran I was considering keeping it or formal occasions such as our daughter's wedding next year.

...I am a traditionalist...

"Traditional" is defined in various ways. The definition I liked best (I'm paraphrasing)

"A traditional thing goes back to an unknown origin, and survives to this day through an unbroken process of evolution."

In other words traditional things are still in current ordinary use. If something went out of use at some point in the past it's a historical thing. Historical things can undergo Revival, and such revivals can come into modern ordinary use. But they're still revivals, not a surviving Tradition.

I define "traditional Highland Dress" as the form of dress that stabilised in its current form by around 1930.

Long hair sporrans were the main sporrans worn in all modes of Highland Dress in Victorian times (civilian Day Dress, civilian Evening Dress, and military dress) but around World War One were replaced by small round pocketlike leather sporrans, small animal-mask sporrans, and revived Culloden sporrans.

Evening Dress was different! Yes by the 1930s the long horsehair Victorian sporrans were considered passe by many, having been replaced by small round sealskin sporrans.

But even to this day it's not uncommon for men to wear long hair sporrans in Evening Dress.

It would be perfectly fine to wear to your daughter's wedding.

I have read that this type of Sporran is usually only associated with military/pipers.

Yes this is a common attitude. Through the Victorian period long hair sporrans were worn by civilians and military alike. In the army they were worn by pipers, drummers, riflemen, sappers, indeed by the entire Regiment.

However by the 1930s long hair sporrans had fallen from favour entirely for Day Dress and though still considered acceptable for Evening Dress weren't seen as often as the new small sealskin Evening sporrans.

They soldiered on, literally, in the Army, and with civilian Pipe Bands who wore military-style uniforms.

[Jock Scot]

The term "traditional" is difficult to define, particularly as everyone has a perspective on it. However, I think OCR's definition and date of 1930's is as good as we might get. Personally, I tend to use 1918 as a start for the "traditional" period as I think there was a general need/wish for change after The Great War. The changes to kilt attire, in this instance, were slow as kilt attire purchases were on an "as needed" basis. They still are for many traditional kilt wearers in Scotland. Why? Kilts and kilt attire is expensive-----many still want to dress traditionally and in their view, properly------and to do that can be expensive. So a gradual change, on a buy when a replacement is necessary basis, is the way many have chosen to go. So, inevitably the mixture of historical and traditional was bound to happen and the process is still continuing today.

The end result is that the newcomer to kilt attire is often confused more than somewhat, particularly by pictures with no explanations, or incorrect ones and especially as everyone has their own definition of "Historical" and "Traditional". As the multitude of posts on this website wanting clarifications on these two salient points, demonstrate so well.

I do think though there is a big difference between the one "camp" of civilian kilt attire and the other "camp" of military uniforms and pipe band(military and civilian) attire. Many are not able to differentiate between the two "Camps". If they could, it would make understanding kilt attire requirements so much easier.

[Hamish Ramsay]

Posted reply in error to this thread. Apologies

[OC Richard]

It's an interesting though perhaps impossible task to pin down when our modern traditional civilian Highland Dress came entirely into its current form.

Yes World War One is the best and clearest divide between Victorian Highland Dress and modern Traditional Highland Dress.

Though reading Farquar MacQueen Douglas (1910) and seeing the photos he includes tells us that some of the processes had already begun, for example him stipulating the small all-leather sporran for what he calls Morning Dress (what we call Day Dress). These sporrans were just making their appearance at the end of the Victorian period.

And the de-accessorising of Evening Dress had begun too: gone were the crossbelts, swords, powder-horns, pistols, and long plaids, but the smaller Evening Dress belted plaid and the dirk remained. They, too, were gone by the 1920s.