Allowed tartans

[beloitpiper]

Perhaps this has already been discussed, but I was wondering what everybody's opinion was on wearing tartans. Some people buy whatever tartan they think looks pretty. Others buy only their family's or clan's tartan. What do you think?

I personally believe that one should wear only his own tartan (clan's tartan) or an acceptable common tartan (national tartans). It upsets me that Gordon Dress is such a popular tartan, but a vast majority of those wearing it are not Gordons or a sept of Gordon (as I am). I also believe that Black Watch should be restricted to Black Watch soldiers and family of the Black Watch. If somebody cannot find their family, either buy a Royal Stuart or a national tartan and be done with it. Don't parade around in somebody else's colors!

[pbpersson]

Don't parade around in somebody else's colors!

Yes, I keep saying this on this forum and people keep telling me I should wear whatever I darned well please, whatever I think looks nice. However, being a traditional sort of guy and always following "rules" in life I don't know if I can really agree with that point of view.

However, I am NOT Scottish and don't have a drop of Scottish blood but I have already found these tartans that I can wear with pride:

Sweden - where my dad was born and raised
Germany - where my great grandparents came from
Chicago - where I was born
Illinois - where I grew up
Arizona - where I am living now
American National - my country

Along with those, there are TONS of tartans at this site that are of unknown origin. Thus far I have found "orphan" tartans under the following words:

Unidentified
Unnamed
Wilsons

http://www.tartans.scotland.net/tart...?tartan_id=299

I hope this helps.


Phoenix Phil

[Rex_Tremende]

Yes, I keep saying this on this forum and people keep telling me I should wear whatever I darned well please, whatever I think looks nice. However, being a traditional sort of guy and always following "rules" in life I don't know if I can really agree with that point of view.

And yet, Phil, you seem to worry about it quite a bit. No one is making you buy a clan tartan, and by your own posts, an actual traditional kilt is some ways off in the future for you, so what about this concerns you now? Are you finding tartans that you'd like to wear but don't feel entitled, and this is creating some cognitive dissonance for you? It seems that you've already found a list of tartans that is acceptable to you, so why not decide that clan tartans are off limits for you and be done with it? Choose one from your vetted list first and see where it takes you.

As with the Mocker/Original question, there are many opinions about this matter, but the only one that matters is yours. Keep in mind that no one is actually telling you what to do, they are stating their opinion, just as beloitpiper has.

Meanwhile, enjoy that UK that hasn't arrived yet.

Regards,
Rex in Cincinnati

[MacWage]

. . .

Unidentified
Unnamed
Wilsons

http://www.tartans.scotland.net/tart...?tartan_id=299

I hope this helps.


Phoenix Phil

THE reason that many of the unnamed tartans are "Wilsons" is that one of/the premier tartan weaver of the late 18th/early 19th century was Wilson and Sons of Bannokburn (near Stirling and the site of a rather significant famous battle). He/They was one of the first to name tartans after clans and was the "go to" firm for clan chiefs to ID "their" tartans or to weave ones "found" in the clan territories. Earlier, Wilson's used numbers to ID the tartans,but names were more romantic and sold better. Many Wilson's tartans are now clan tartans. Some in the early Wilsons sample books are actually DIFFERENT clan tartans than those known today and some are even DIFFERENT clans entirely. Thus, many tartans were made and sold by the firm that are historical, but now "un-linked" to a particular association.

Be warned though, SOME tartans are legally restricted to certain persons, such as a golf club's members or some particular clan tartans, like that of Harden of Cowenknowles. For the latter, MAKE SURE you get PERMISSION first. Most, fortunately, are not so restricted.

That said, think of tartans as team colors. If I was an NFL (American Football) fan and pulled for the Atlanta Falcons, I would wear red, black, and silver. For the Green Bay Packers, I would wear green and yellow. A friend of mine is a BIG Buffalo Bills fan. Once he wore a pullover that was orange and green. I kidded him about wearing Miami Dolphins (the Bills biggest rival) colors and he LITERALLY removed the shirt and BURNED IT in front of me. For Brits, think Liverpool and Manchester or Rangers and Celtic.

If you wear a tartan, you are supporting what that tartan represents (clan, region, group, et cetera). Most tartan/kilt wearers know this innately, others are clueless (most of the latter never find this forum, much less join). Be prepared to know the tartan, what it means/represents, and a logical/reasonable rational for wearing that tartan.

[MacWage]

THE reason that many of the unnamed tartans are "Wilsons" is that one of/the premier tartan weaver of the late 18th/early 19th century was Wilson and Sons of Bannokburn (near Stirling and the site of a rather significant famous battle). He/They was one of the first to name tartans after clans and was the "go to" firm for clan chiefs to ID "their" tartans or to weave ones "found" in the clan territories. Earlier, Wilson's used numbers to ID the tartans,but names were more romantic and sold better. Many Wilson's tartans are now clan tartans. Some in the early Wilsons sample books are actually DIFFERENT clan tartans than those known today and some are even DIFFERENT clans entirely. Thus, many tartans were made and sold by the firm that are historical, but now "un-linked" to a particular association.

Be warned though, SOME tartans are legally restricted to certain persons, such as a golf club's members or some particular clan tartans, like that of Harden of Cowenknowles. For the latter, MAKE SURE you get PERMISSION first. Most, fortunately, are not so restricted.

That said, think of tartans as team colors. If I was an NFL (American Football) fan and pulled for the Atlanta Falcons, I would wear red, black, and silver. For the Green Bay Packers, I would wear green and yellow. A friend of mine is a BIG Buffalo Bills fan. Once he wore a pullover that was orange and green. I kidded him about wearing Miami Dolphins (the Bills biggest rival) colors and he LITERALLY removed the shirt and BURNED IT in front of me. For Brits, think Liverpool and Manchester or Rangers and Celtic.

If you wear a tartan, you are supporting what that tartan represents (clan, region, group, et cetera). Most tartan/kilt wearers know this innately, others are clueless (most of the latter never find this forum, much less join). Be prepared to know the tartan, what it means/represents, and a logical/reasonable rational for wearing that tartan.

WOW!!!!!
NOW I remember this thread from a year ago. It is interesting reading the flow of the thread.

I STILL hold to the above sports analogy.
The Tartans are only a couple hundred years old in clan associations, but those associations are VERY stong.
When one wears ANY tartan, they are associating themselves with the meaning of that tartan.

Now, a year later, I now own box pleat kilts in: "Jedi" (Greenville 2006), Caledonia, Carolina, and 13 oz X Marks, am working on MacNeil, USA Bicent. (for completion by July 4th), and Wallace, and have Gordon and 16 oz X marks on the way, plus a "wish-list" that will make over 20 kilts when/if I get them all. ALL 20 have specific and special meaning FOR ME. None are chosen "for the colors" and all have "ties" in some form or fashion. I STILL do not own a solid kilt (though I have canvas and wool to make some, though the wool has become balmorals/tams/bonnets).
I STILL have a number of belted plaids, but I have worn only one ONCE in the last year.

Interesting thread to revive. I enjoyed reading it. Thanks.

[McFarkus]

However, I am NOT Scottish and don't have a drop of Scottish blood but I have already found these tartans that I can wear with pride:

Chicago - where I was born
Illinois - where I grew up

Phoenix Phil

The Chicago tartan is the University of Chicago tartan, not a municipal tartan and the Illinois tartan is the Illinois St. Andrew's Society tartan, not a state tartan. So these are not strictly general tartans.

As the family genealogist, I made a list of clans from whom we have a direct descent and have used that when selecting tartans. There was one on ebay in my size that was not on the list, so I did a little research and found that we had intermarried with that clan sufficiently to claim a connection. I feel better if I can trace the connection.

That said, it is my personal choice to do that, and I have no problem with someone else wearing the tartan as long as they know what tartan they're wearing and treat it with respect.

[Scott Gilmore]

Perhaps this has already been discussed

It has.

I personally believe that one should wear only his own tartan (clan's tartan) or an acceptable common tartan (national tartans). It upsets me that Gordon Dress is such a popular tartan....

Why does this upset you? In what manner has someone wearing a Gordon tartan offended you? Have they been disrespectful? How?

Did it ever occur to you that they are honoring clan Gordon by wearing that tartan?

Sounds like a personal problem.

Regards,
Scott Gilmore

[arrogcow]

The problem with the "Rules", is that there aren't any. No one grants rules to tartans. There are people that say you can only wear your clan, there are other people that are honored if you wear their clan. The other thing is, "what is a clan tartan". For instance there are about a dozen tartans with the name Wilson. Only one is the actual Wilson tartan, gthe rest were just designed by a weaver who had the name Wilson, so go crazy and wear any of those you want.

Now having said that, I do understand the desire to have an association with a tatan. As has been said, most states (and some cities) have a tartan, there are armed forces tartans, college tartans, and generic tartans.

But all in all most reasonable people don't care as long as you show the tartan respect. As for where you get a family connection, I was just reading an article this weekend talking about common ancestry. Many experts are calculating that between 900-1500 years ago there existed a person who is now related to everyone in the entire world. Ergo you are related to every clan somehow.

Adam

[KiltedKnight]

Don't parade around in somebody else's colors!

By your reasoning then if someone with the last name of BROWN or BLACK were to take offence if you were to wear a shirt in those particular colors then you shouldn't wear them or any color that is associated with a name, right?

Show me where it is written that someone who is or is not even of Scottish blood shouldn't wear any tartan they take a liking to and then we'll agree but since it isn't written and it seems that you're just barking up the wrong tree I would suggest that you don't go around checking IDs if you see someone wearing any particular tartan, it is none of your business.

Personally I wore my own Clans tartan for years before I decided to expand my horizons and purchase other tartans.

Sorry if I sound rude but the post is not polite to begin with and the demand was rediculous.

Chris.

[KiltedKnight]

I just checked your profile, perhaps I would have understood more had I done it before my first post but you shouldn't be making judgement call while still wet behind the ears. There are many men who have been wearing the tartan since before you were born and again, show me where the rule book is that backs up your demand.

Chris.