What's Modern Kilt Wear> ...or...what's this subforum really about?

**Alan H** · 12th June 11, 12:31 PM

I certainly can see the viewpoint that wearing a traditional wool, tartan kilt with...say, a polo shirt might be thought of as "modern kilt wear". Also, a kilt made of tartan cloth, but perhaps made of polyester-viscose or acrylic, or even a wool blend might be thought of as "modern kilt wear". A solid-color (not saffron) wool kilt made in the traditional manner might be thought of as "modern" just by virtue of the solid color. I get that!

The "sub-header" on this forum says -

"The place for discussion about the ways the kilt is being worn today. (Basically from the mid 1980's to today.)"

To my mind, I've always thought of this sub-forum as a place to discuss items like Freedom Kilts (Steve's non-tartan offerings), R-Kilts, Utilikilts, Amerikilts, X-Kilts, Alt.kilt, TFCK , Blacklader, and so on. But that's just me.

IT SEEMS TO ME... and again, this is just me.... that we have 30+ sub-forums where guys discuss tartan kilts and associated topics.. Can't we have just ONE sub-forum where guys can come to discuss kilts which are completely non-traditional?

I thought this WAS that sub-forum, but it seems to me like perhaps that's not how others view it.

What are your thoughts? Please, oh please, don't write "I don't like these modern kilts". I mean, if you don't like them, that's totally fine, right? The question I'm trying to bring up is not about whether people like them, or whether they're even kilts at all....NOT. The question is really ...what is this sub-forum is really all about? and possibly a related corollary What would we LIKE this sub-forum to be about?

**Bugbear** · 12th June 11, 12:46 PM

I don't know, Alan, I've been confused about all this too, and get corrected on the terms etc from time to time. All I can figure is to put "Non-Traditional" as the first words of the title of the post, and hope for the best.

**Chas** · 12th June 11, 12:49 PM

For my part, I will say this - I don't know what I don't know. But I certainly want to know. I have only seen a modern kilt worn on two occasions and I believe that they were both utilikilts. So I know nothing about any other type or manufacturer.

Humans tend to fear the unknown, so the more we know the less we will fear and the less we will dislike.

As I say, I don't know, so hopefully those who do, will impart their knowledge.

Regards

Chas

**The Wizard of BC** · 12th June 11, 01:10 PM

Oh come on Chas, you have seen modern kilts worn in a modern way many times. I can remember meeting you at Ferintosh and spending quite a bit of time around you.
I was wearing a modern kilt in the modern way the entire time. As were everyone else there that I remember.

To me and the reason I put the part about "since about the 1980's" at the top of this forum was to give those who don't always wear the kilt in the way that those in the Historical or Traditional sections do.

To me this means if you don't wear a jacket, or wear your kilt with boots, or you wear a kilt constructed in the modern styles.

It can also mean that perhaps you wear your kilt in non traditional places.

What I was trying to do is to give those who want to wear their traditional style kilts in the traditional manner a specific place to talk about how they wear their kilt.
This section was to give the vast majority of us who wear our kilt everyday in todays world a place to discuss how we do it.

Sadly what seems to often happen is the posts which could be here end up in "show us your pics" or "Genral kilt talk".

I find it strange that the modern kilt wearers don't seem to see a need to go into the Traditional wear sections of the forum and tell those there how bad they look or how much they would never wear that type of kilt or wear it that way.

I would suggest that we here be given the same courtesy.

**Chas** · 12th June 11, 01:38 PM

Originally Posted by The Wizard of BC

Oh come on Chas, you have seen modern kilts worn in a modern way many times. I can remember meeting you at Ferintosh and spending quite a bit of time around you.
I was wearing a modern kilt in the modern way the entire time. As were everyone else there that I remember.

To me and the reason I put the part about "since about the 1980's" at the top of this forum was to give those who don't always wear the kilt in the way that those in the Historical or Traditional sections do.

To me this means if you don't wear a jacket, or wear your kilt with boots, or you wear a kilt constructed in the modern styles.

It can also mean that perhaps you wear your kilt in non traditional places.

What I was trying to do is to give those who want to wear their traditional style kilts in the traditional manner a specific place to talk about how they wear their kilt.
This section was to give the vast majority of us who wear our kilt everyday in todays world a place to discuss how we do it.

Sadly what seems to often happen is the posts which could be here end up in "show us your pics" or "Genral kilt talk".

I find it strange that the modern kilt wearers don't seem to see a need to go into the Traditional wear sections of the forum and tell those there how bad they look or how much they would never wear that type of kilt or wear it that way.

I would suggest that we here be given the same courtesy.

I see what you are saying , Steve. In honesty, I would have thought that we were dressed casually, rather than modernly. I think I need to think about this.

Regards

Chas

**Cygnus** · 12th June 11, 01:17 PM

I think the real question is whether or not the sub-forum is exclusively about modern kilts, if it branches into other elements of modern kilt-wear, or it it includes any sort of kilt-wearing in the modern age.

Judging by the sorts of things I've seen in here, I don't think there is any consensus on which of the three it is.

I'm all for there being a sub-forum dedicated to non-traditional kilts and have always seen this as the place for that. Though there are other elements of kilt-wear that are non-traditional.

So where do you draw the line? Is a person wearing a traditional tartan kilt with a modern sporran supposed to post here? What about a person wearing an otherwise traditional outfit with a pair of modern hiking boots?

I guess what I'm saying is that there are shades of modernism/traditionalism, and some things aren't so obviously one or the other.

EDIT: I wrote my post as Steve was writing - thanks for the clarification!

**The Wizard of BC** · 12th June 11, 04:39 PM

OK, here are a couple of examples..

Dr. Nick Fiddes and myself.

Nick is dressed Traditionally and I Modern.

My Tartan is not traditional. It's the X Marks Tartan - The world's first internet Tartan.

My shoes are not traditional. They are loafers with the little tassels on the top. I call them my yuppie shoes and tell people that the tassles always point to the nearest Starbucks.

Oops, traditional garter ties. How did they slip in there.

Traditional sporran? Sorry, no. Stillwater Nightstalker in leather.

Shirt is not traditional.

Modern belt.

And the Kilt? Heck it's got pockets for gosh sake. That can't be traditional.

**cessna152towser** · 12th June 11, 04:42 PM

From a Scottish perspective it never fails to amaze me how deep is the divide between traditionalists and utilikiltarians, but lets not blame the North Americans, the divide is as deep if not deeper here in Scotland where non-trad kilts are less common. For example, today I have been wearing a non-trad kilt (ie Utility kilt style with cargo pockets) because I have been hanging banners around town for our highland games next week and didn't want to get an expensive trad kilt messed up. Afterwards I went round to friends for tea (the man is a regular wearer of traditional kilts) and his wife remarked "I thought you were wearing a kilt at first but I see that its a skirt you are wearing, I don't like those".
I see this forum as a place where we can have sub forums for all styles of kilts and it should not be right for one faction to personally attack the other's choice of clothing attire.