REAL stumper... Argyll Buttons

[RockyR]

Guys,

Here's a question I posed to a couple experts in Scotland and had them stumped. Let's see if any of the experts up here can help...

On the buttons for the PC and/or Argyll jacket, there is a rampant lion. It's pretty obviously a symbol of Scotland. However, there are ALSO a few words. In no particular order (don't know which is first and which is last):

Clann n
ar Sael
Ansram
Gracrelle

The first 2 wrap around a corner, so it MAY be "Clann Nar Sael"

Anyone have any ideas? I am TRULY stumped and have wondered what it means for a long time.

[davidlpope]

Clann na gael...

The font is a bit wonky(g looks like an s, etc.) so letters are not always what they appear. My guess is that it was supposed to be Scots Gaelic but the manufacturer doesn't speak the Gaelic so it came out as nonsense.

It does make one wonder what it was supposed to be...

[Jock Scot]

I have absolutely no idea and I have not met anyone who has!

[RockyR]

I have absolutely no idea and I have not met anyone who has!

And yet we all wear them on our dress jackets.

On further inspection, the Ansram has the first line in the M starting UP... maybe more like a cursive Un or like an \M (hard to draw with text... sorry). If it was a bad 'translation' from an older button, could it be

Ansraun or something like that? I think we're on the right track with the letters being mis-scribed over time.

[CelticSire]

Here is my SWAG (Scientific Wild A** Guess): Tell me if this makes sense: It’s a poor attempt at something similar to “Clann na ngael ansr am an cheile” “The families of the Highlands answer only to each other” (I don’t speak Gaelic, either Irish or Scot, but I do have some experience working with languages) I'm sure the Gaelic isn't correct, but close?

[Chas]

We have had exactly this same discussion before - within the last two years. I have tried searching but can find nothing.

Regards

Chas

[Slowburn]

Here is my SWAG (Scientific Wild A** Guess): Tell me if this makes sense: It’s a poor attempt at something similar to “Clann na ngael ansr am an cheile” “The families of the Highlands answer only to each other” (I don’t speak Gaelic, either Irish or Scot, but I do have some experience working with languages) I'm sure the Gaelic isn't correct, but close?

This sounds appropriate for the conditions of the time a subtle mask of ones alliance to the jacobite cause, maybe.

[spglenn]

And yet we all wear them on our dress jackets.

Speak for yourself (and many others) I have Brian Boru buttons on mine

[ForresterModern]

Speak for yourself (and many others) I have Brian Boru buttons on mine

Although I have the standard Rampant Lion square buttons on my Argyle and waistcoat, I replaced my Brian Boru harp buttons with round Fleur de lis buttons to honor both my pre-scottish ancient Flemish ancestry (part of the Norman invasion in 1066 that settled in lower Scotland) as well as my current location of residence, Louisville, KY, originally founded by the French.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

clann na ngael == children (or family) of the Gaels (ie the Gaelic speaking people, which, in Scotland would be the population of the Highlands).