Thread counts for a tartan

**Toraba** · 2nd February 14, 07:22 PM

Hello everyone,

I know there is no absolute rule in regards to a thread count, other than it should be an even number.

I also understand that most symmetrical tartans are in generally comprised of between 75-250 threads to create the sett. This being the case, does it mean that asymmetrical tartans could be double this number of threads in some cases? I know that Black Watch is around 419 threads, being an asymmetrical sett.

I would like to know what tartan has the highest thread count?

And based on that, how large the thread count could be and yet still produce a good sett measuring between 7.5 - 9 inches?

I realized the weight of the fabric is relevant so lets assume one is using a 13 oz fabric.

Any thoughts?

Cheers,
Trevor

**Barb T** · 2nd February 14, 07:36 PM

??Not sure what you're asking. All you need to know is the # of threads per inch in the fabric as woven and multiply it by the sett size. Last time I measured, heavy weight tartan was somewhere around 40 tpi (threads per inch). So that would be 300 threads for 7.5" and 360 for a 9" sett.

The biggest sett I've ever made a kilt from had a sett of about 16", which would be 640 threads in heavy weight for one sett.

Am I missing something in your question?

**Toraba** · 2nd February 14, 08:34 PM

Thank you. And no, I'm sure I'm the one who is confused.

So one could say that most symmetrical setts are generally about a 300 threads. Thus is it reasonable to conclude that a large asymmetrical sett could be as many as 600 threads and measure around 15"?

And again if anyone knows, what is the largest asymmetrical sett out there?

Also does anyone know the thread count for Canadian Rite and the Maple Leaf (National Tartan of Canada)?

Thank you.

**Steve Ashton** · 2nd February 14, 09:27 PM

The symmetry of a Tartan would have very little to do with what I think you are asking.

Let me give you an example

One weaver, Marton Mills, when weaving their Jura, 16oz fabric use 14.7 ends per cm.
Their 13 oz Bute uses 17.5 ends per cm.
And their 12 oz P/V uses 26 ends per cm.

Some weavers use larger yarns the achieve the different weights.

This is regardless of the thread count of the Tartan. Any Tartan woven in these weights fabric would have the exact same number of ends per cm.

Yes, some Tartans have a larger Sett, some smaller. And a weaver may alter the thread count of a particular Thread count to achieve a desired Sett size.

If a Tartan is symmetrical or unsymmetrical is totally dependent on the thread count of the Tartan. The same Tartan may be woven in any weight fabric, using the number of ends per cm to achieve the desired weight of the fabric.

So you cannot use a generality that an asymmetrical Tartan would have more threads per cm. (or inches if you wish).

OK, now let's look at a particular Tartan.

Let's say for example a Thread count of Tartan X is 240 threads in one full Sett. (This is sometimes expressed as 120 threads between pivot points.)
The Sett Size of this Tartan when woven in 16 oz Jura fabric would have a Sett size of 6.5 inches.
When woven in 13oz Bute fabric would have a Sett size of 5 3/8 inches.

I hope this makes this concept a little easier to understand.

**Steve Ashton** · 2nd February 14, 09:33 PM

Yoraba,

You may get the thread count of any Tartan. You must sign up with the Scottish Register of Tartan (It's free) and then request a thread count.

**figheadair** · 3rd February 14, 12:09 AM

Originally Posted by Toraba

I also understand that most symmetrical tartans are in generally comprised of between 75-250 threads to create the sett. This being the case, does it mean that asymmetrical tartans could be double this number of threads in some cases? I know that Black Watch is around 419 threads, being an asymmetrical sett.

In any sett the number of threads for a given tartan will vary according to the weight of the cloth. The Black Watch tartan, which is not asymmetric, for example has a count of 418 threads for a full repeat beased on Wilsons' 1819 count for Coarse Kilts. This gave a full repeat of rought 10.45 inches.

I would like to know what tartan has the highest thread count?

Amongst the generally available tartans the Drummond of Strathallan/Ogilvie has the highest threadcount for a complete sett.

**unixken** · 3rd February 14, 12:31 AM

Originally Posted by figheadair

Amongst the generally available tartans the Drummond of Strathallan/Ogilvie has the highest threadcount for a complete sett.

See the notation in the Scottish Register of Tartans for the Ogilvie tartan. Particularly, note the comment "One full sett (repeat) of the pattern takes up the width of the loom." http://www.tartanregister.gov.uk/tar....aspx?ref=3222

**figheadair** · 3rd February 14, 06:35 AM

Originally Posted by unixken

See the notation in the Scottish Register of Tartans for the Ogilvie tartan. Particularly, note the comment "One full sett (repeat) of the pattern takes up the width of the loom." http://www.tartanregister.gov.uk/tar....aspx?ref=3222

Depending on the width of the loom of course.

**unixken** · 3rd February 14, 07:50 AM

Originally Posted by figheadair

Depending on the width of the loom of course.

Likewise, any tartan can theoretically be scaled to make a single repeat fill the width of the loom. ;)

**Toraba** · 8th February 14, 05:05 PM

Thank you for the follow up everyone and sorry for a delayed reply. I work shift work, thus I'm not always able to reply in a timely manner.
So the tartan I have been working on is 940 threads in an asymmetrical sett.
Though I have followed everything everyone has so generously shared with me so far, I'm still unsure if the tartan I am working on will work.
I'm going to have to send an image to an expert an see if it can be woven.
Thank you everyone.