Prince Charlie

[AustinDiver]

How long should a Prince Charlie jacket be?

I just received one. It appears a little longer than traditional. I probably got the chest a little too large. It is comfortable.
The manufacturer followed the measurements.

The picture is a little sloppy. 242425557_4528295733925021_3335951609284457796_n.jpg

[McMurdo]

Honestly the length is not bad, it may be a wee bit large but I've seen worse. If it bothers you perhaps you could take it to a tailor and explain what you think needs done and get their opinion. Here is me in my PC and i think the length is close to what you have.



Here is a photo with 4 of us in formal wear, 3 wearing PC's. Notice the sleeve length on all of us:



It looks to me that the fly plaid is pulling that side down which is causing issues throughout. Also the ghillie brogues are tied in two different positions. I just noticed that the top of the kilt can be seen over the waistcoat I would say that the entire thing is probably a size too large, again take it a tailor to have it looked at but go to someone who has worked with Highland Wear before.

[gsmacleod]

It might be a bit too long but it's hard to tell as it seems your fly plaid is pulling everything down on your left hand side. I'd try it without the fly plaid and see how it sits then.

Your waistcoat does seem to be too long as you shouldn't see the top of your kilt above the buttons of the waistcoat. IIWY, I would look at shortening the body of the waist coat so the top button is above the top of your kilt.

Shane

[AustinDiver]

Thanks,

The brooch and fly plaid are available. The brooch looks neat, but it is heavy. I doubt that I will wear them often. I am not sure how often I will wear the Prince Charlie. I probably should have gone with a 46" or 47" chest size. I read that British sizing is tight.

The kilt showing up above the waistcoat concerned me. I probably would not worry too much except for that. I usually see the opposite problem in pictures on the internet, where the shirt shows up between the waistcoat and the kilt. The kilt is 26" long and sits right below my rib cage or about 2-2 1/2" above the navel.

The kilt feels fine. I like them sitting at that point.

I was hesitant to post the picture because of some of the other "sloppiness" like the shoes, and bow tie were not quite right.

I am not sure about finding tailors in Austin, TX who are familiar with "Highland Dress", I will call around.

The waistcoat issue might have shown up with a 46" chest size, 44" would be too small. The back of the waist coat sits at the top of the kilt.

Honestly, I think that they made the sizing for someone with a big belly. That may have been true about 4 years ago. I have a little bit of a belly. I am about 195 lbs at 6' 2".

The picture has some sloppiness that would not do well in public.

242488097_4528295590591702_9126253777752104440_n (1).jpg

[McMurdo]

I think the second photo is a huge improvement, I would simply add a dress sporran.

[gsmacleod]

I think the second photo is a huge improvement, I would simply add a dress sporran.

Agreed; without the fly plaid, everything seems to be sitting much better!

Shane

[Touchstone]

242488097_4528295590591702_9126253777752104440_n (1).jpg

If I may divert the conversation back to Prince Charlies ...

On a recent vacation I was showing my wife some of the styles of jackets worn with kilts (I started wearing a kilt only recently, and we have no providers in my home city). When I slipped on a Prince Charlie she was stunned. "That's not you!" she said. And she's right; when I'm not wearing a kilt I tend toward jeans and drab shirts. What caught her eye was the proliferation of silvered buttons.

"But you should see Sean Connery ... he really rocks a kilt!" I said and later did an image search to convince her. To my surprise, in the rather famous pictures of Connery kilted (I think from an award ceremony?) he is wearing a PC, but it doesn't have the two angled sets of three buttons on either side, just a simple three buttons right at the closure. This would indeed be more "me".

Any comments on this topic? Can anyone suggest a provider for this simpler PC?

I'm also interested in replacing the chrome-y buttons on my black Argyll with something a little less glittery - a true silver, German silver, etc., but am not having much luck finding these. Suggestions?

[Tomo]

A picture would help - some photos he does indeed wear a standard looking PC. However, in others (assuming I have the right one) he is wearing something more like a civilian mess jacket.

Houston - who we mentioned earlier in the thread does one - but it has lots of tartan trim on it (although as a custom job I am sure you ask for something else).

However, I think this from Kinloch Anderson is on the money: https://www.kinlochanderson.com/shop...black-barathea

The describe it as: "The Kinloch Anderson Coatee is a tailored short kilt jacket style worn open and is unique to Kinloch Anderson. It is made using premium quality Black Barathea has silk lapels and tails at the back and is trimmed with Celtic buttons on the jacket and jacket cuffs. The vest is fastened with three Celtic buttons. This is also available in Velvet and Coloured Worsted.

In terms of buttons - the standard silver buttons are available in an antique finish (sort of overlaid with a b lack coating that fills in the relief elements) and black - you may also find other styles if you shop around. Kinloch Anderson sells spare buttons (in their own style) but I haven't checked the options on finishes.

[OC Richard]

...in the rather famous pictures of Connery kilted he is wearing a PC, but it doesn't have the two angled sets of three buttons on either side, just a simple three buttons right at the closure.

Any comments on this topic? Can anyone suggest a provider for this simpler PC?

That's an alternate way to make PCs that as far as I know has been around since PCs were invented, sometime shortly after 1900.

It's probably not simpler for the maker, in that a row of buttonholes are often made, while the style which has become most common nowadays doesn't have any buttonholes on the jacket.

Here's that style of PC in the Rowans 1938 catalogue



Here's a current maker making that style of PC, though this one is in tweed.

I'm also interested in replacing the chrome buttons on my black Argyll with something a little less glittery - a true silver, German silver, etc., but am not having much luck finding these. Suggestions?

For sure the uber-shiny chrome buttons cheapen the look of the jacket. There are some makers who use buttons that have a pewter look, and I've seen antiqued buttons too, both of which look nicer.

Back in Victorian times black Argylls, and black doublets, often had ordinary black buttons, the sort you can get at any fabric shop. That would get you totally away from the blingy look.

Anyhow here are antiqued buttons up on Ebay now

https://www.ebay.com/itm/12481045439...BoCI-MQAvD_BwE

Here's a gent in the 1860s, note that his black doublet has ordinary black buttons. What's often overlooked is that in many images of Victorians in what what we would consider overly ornate costumes the jackets are quite plain, jackets which we wouldn't consider "kilt jackets" at all.

[Jock Scot]

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I'm also interested in replacing the chrome-y buttons on my black Argyll with something a little less glittery - a true silver, German silver, etc., but am not having much luck finding these. Suggestions?

If it is of any help, I have two sets of buttons for my black barathea silver buttoned argyll(BBSBA), one set are the normal "silver" colour and also a set of black(plastic?) buttons. The jacket has holes--------put there by the tailor----- where the buttons go and its a simple matter of removing a split ring taking out the button and replacing the other coloured button and then replacing the split ring. In my view, black buttons with a black argyll are very effective when the occasion demands or when the mood takes.