Grrrr!...

**12stones** · 21st January 09, 07:33 AM

To add to Cajunscott's reply, it's probably easier to be cheaper when the cost of the dinner and entertainment are shared amongst 50 people than amongst 20 people. I'm not sure how many people attended Tokyo's Burns Dinner last year, but I have to guess that it's not as many as one would think. Add to that the value of the yen/dollar over the past year and it just seems more expensive this year.

Sorry to hear you can't go, but I'm with the others. Host your own little Burns dinner.

**macwilkin** · 21st January 09, 07:42 AM

Originally Posted by CDNSushi

LOL! I just got a "ding" in my Gmail box. Seems that the St. Andrews Society of Tokyo and Yokohama is havin' just a weeeee bit o' trouble hawking those ridiculously priced Burns supper tickets.

Here's an excerpt of what they sent me:

Somehow, I think many have lost the whole concept of Scots being a FRUGAL people. This whole kilted hobby thing is really starting to affect my bottom line here... Bloody expensive comes to mind.

That's STILL $220 per person. And I can still get a nice kilt for $440 (even if I write off the cost of traveling to and staying in Tokyo overnight). You know what they can do with that invitation...
:butt:

As such, I REALLY REALLY liked the suggestions that others had in this thread -- just hold your own! Brilliant idea! But that I'll discuss somewhere else... as I really don't want to threadjack my own thread. LOL.

Again, I think you're being a bit unfair to a group that you are not a member of. Why not join them & volunteer for the Burns Night committee? Perhaps after seeing it from the organiser's POV, $220 really won't seem as extreme as you think.

It's one thing to not want to pay the cost of their ticket, but it's another thing to make snide remarks such as "you know what they can do with their invitation..." Do you know these people personally?

Remember, "frugal" and "cheap" are not necessarily equal.

Sorry if I offend with my frankness, but I've heard this line of grousing ad nauseum.

Todd

**CDNSushi** · 21st January 09, 08:21 AM

Todd, no offense intended to you either because it's obvious that you're looking at it from a very different viewpoint but if it weren't possible to do it for less then I'd be much more sympathetic but when someone decides they absolutely MUST have the swankiest joint in town for a venue then they open themselves up to some criticism.

Obviously, the group's desire to having something posh and upper-class is more of a priority than making it accessible to more people. It's clear already that they over-estimated the number of people in general sharing the organizers' views. It's not that I disagree that the money is being spent appropriately (for venue, live entertainment, etc) but I absolutely KNOW that it could have been done for far less had they so desired. I've served on numerous organizing committees myself, the most recent of which was being in charge of taking care of purchasing/organizing/administering buying food and cooking meals at our church's winter retreat. This, as the church isn't exactly rich, required careful budgeting, planning and being able to "make-do" with the resources I was given.

Now having said that, there are some good reasons why I wouldn't volunteer for this society's committee(s), first and foremost being the fact that I live in another city almost two hours away. Second, I don't just look out for myself. It would be rather selfish of me to be a part of a committee for the sole purpose of extracting something cheap out of it for myself. I'm more interested in being able to have my wife and some of our friends come and join us too. For me to get mine and then for them to have to pay the full price isn't what I'm trying to achieve here.

Again, obviously we don't see eye to eye on this but there's more to this issue than just me just idly griping.

As for my "snide remarks" well -- I don't believe the St. A. soc of Tokyo is exactly above reproach here. If I meant everything I said at face value as you seem to think, I probably wouldn't have used the smilies I did to indicate that there was some humour in it. I guess you didn't realize that...

**macwilkin** · 21st January 09, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by CDNSushi

Todd, no offense intended to you either because it's obvious that you're looking at it from a very different viewpoint but if it weren't possible to do it for less then I'd be much more sympathetic but when someone decides they absolutely MUST have the swankiest joint in town for a venue then they open themselves up to some criticism.

Obviously, the group's desire to having something posh and upper-class is more of a priority than making it accessible to more people. It's clear already that they over-estimated the number of people in general sharing the organizers' views. It's not that I disagree that the money is being spent appropriately (for venue, live entertainment, etc) but I absolutely KNOW that it could have been done for far less had they so desired. I've served on numerous organizing committees myself, the most recent of which was being in charge of taking care of purchasing/organizing/administering buying food and cooking meals at our church's winter retreat. This, as the church isn't exactly rich, required careful budgeting, planning and being able to "make-do" with the resources I was given.

Now having said that, there are some good reasons why I wouldn't volunteer for this society's committee(s), first and foremost being the fact that I live in another city almost two hours away. Second, I don't just look out for myself. It would be rather selfish of me to be a part of a committee for the sole purpose of extracting something cheap out of it for myself. I'm more interested in being able to have my wife and some of our friends come and join us too. For me to get mine and then for them to have to pay the full price isn't what I'm trying to achieve here.

Again, obviously we don't see eye to eye on this but there's more to this issue than just me just idly griping.

As for my "snide remarks" well -- I don't believe the St. A. soc of Tokyo is exactly above reproach here. If I meant everything I said at face value as you seem to think, I probably wouldn't have used the smilies I did to indicate that there was some humour in it. I guess you didn't realize that...

I never implied that you would be looking out for yourself by volunteering; I meant that you might see things from the other perspective by being a part of it. For the record, some societies do offer members discounts on tickets. That's one of the benefits of being a member, nothing to be ashamed of.

We have an unwritten rule in our society that whenever someone complains about one of our events, we always respond, "Great -- what will you do to help us make it better?" Sadly, most people say, "I'm too busy", "I didn't mean that", etc. They're willing to complain about something, but when called to help, they suddenly lose their enthusiasm.

Again, though...you seem to be making some judgements on these people -- do you know them personally, or are you making assumptions? And your comparison to a church committee is an ironic one, as many St. Andrew's Societies use part of the funds raised at events like Burns Suppers for charitable functions -- the whole original purpose of St. Andrew's/Caledonian societies, etc. was mutual-aid for distressed countrymen, after all.

Yes, you may have used smilies, and you may have been talking "tounge-in-cheek" -- all I'm saying is to walk a mile in their ghillies before you make assumptions. Our Burns Supper is at one of the "swankiest joints in town", yet we present a quality program for the cost. We had a lady make a similar statement about finding a cheaper venue and cheaper cost this year; when we asked her to join the committee, she declined.

Regards,

Todd

**meinfs** · 21st January 09, 05:29 PM

Originally Posted by cajunscot

... Perhaps after seeing it from the organiser's POV, ...

OFF off-topic:

Finally, finally, I'm know what "POV" means. It's in total context of the statement. Thanks

**thescot** · 21st January 09, 05:44 PM

And we were worring that the Great SEKS Supper in Conyers was too pricey at $14.00!

I like the idea of skipping the dinner and buying a kilt. Or a sporran. Or hand-knit hose. Or . . .

**thescot** · 21st January 09, 05:51 PM

Speaking of holding your own . . .

that's why we do our own. The local St. Andrews Society if a little too swanky for the likes of us--invitation only--and the Burns Society in Atlanta is limited to a certain number of members--with a waiting list.

So we formed the Great SEKS, and I started planning and chairing one the way I like it. It's plenty dressy--or not--we have all of the required parts--mostly--and the food and atmosphere--great Xmarkers mostly--are fine.

This year, we even have our own piper, so we're moving up in the world.

Yeah, Sushi, do your own and have fun. Being in Japan will probably make it more expensive than here do to costs, but you won't have to take a second mortgage on the kids!

**CDNSushi** · 3rd February 09, 10:41 PM

Weelll, I've gone THIS far in informing people about the Burns Supper in Tokyo, so I may as well post the latest word I got from the St. Andrews Society...

Ticket prices have dropped again. They are now the same as they were last year... ¥15000. Now I can at least consider it... (Although, whether or not we go to this one, I still plan on holding my own in July around the time of the anniversary of Burns's death)