Subtle difference?

[Father Bill]

I hear here (!) two terms that may or may not mean the same thing, and I'm looking for clarification. One is "box pleat." The other is "military box pleat." I know that the box pleat was often associated with the military, but is there a difference?

[Downunder Kilt]

Hope this helps Father Bill

[Father Bill]

Hope this helps Father Bill

Perfect! Thanks!

[sevenoaks]

Thank you. That clears it up in my mind. Like they say... A picture is worth a thousand words. Great!

[M. A. C. Newsome]

That illustration helps, but I think a better illustration might show what a box pleated kilt looks like when made with four yards, six yards, eight yards, etc.

On a traditional four yard box pleated kilt, the pleats generally look like the one simply called "box pleat" above. There is little to no overlap of the interior of the pleats.

Now, imagine the same pleating style but made with five yards, or six yards. There will be slightly more cloth. That means there will be slightly more pleats, and those pleats will be slightly more narrow. It also means that at least one side of the box pleats (typically the right side) will be deeper, to take in the extra cloth.

I, in fact, have a kilt like this. It's my newest kilt, box pleated, made from six yards of cloth.

It doesn't really look that much different from a four yard box pleated kilt from this angle, but if I were to take a picture from the "bottom up" the way the B&W line illustrations are, you'd see the pleats are much deeper on one side than the other. There are also about 12 pleats in that kilt, compared with the 8 or 9 pleats I typically get when I make a four yard box pleated kilt for myself.

If you continue this line of thinking for an eight yard kilt, the number of pleats, and the narrowness of those pleats, will be akin to what we are used to seeing in a modern day eight yard knife pleated kilt. But they will be box pleats. The left side of the pleat will be fairly shallow, while the right side will be deep, like a knife pleat. In fact, they look rather like knife pleats "turned in" on themselves. Which a lot of people, unfamiliar with the history of kilts and the various ways they are pleated, tend to think they are.

So the easiest answer to what the difference is between a box pleated kilt and a "military box pleated kilt" is that a military box pleated kilt is simply a box pleated kilt made from 8 yards of cloth. (And often not even that!)

[Riverkilt]

The military box pleat that my kiltmaker sews is very intricate - would guess same as the sketch. She went back to kiltmaker's school in Scotland to take a course focused entirely on the "proper" way to make a military box pleat. From what I understand it is a difficult - or at least taxing - pleat to sew, costs extra for that craftsmanship, and is a thing of beauty when done properly.

[Father Bill]

Wow! That's a lot of information, Matt. I'm considering a box pleat for my next kilt, and wondering how to choose between all the options. I was thinking I wanted something simpler than a knife-pleat, but now I'm not sure and more than a bit confused.

I hear fellows saying that a box-pleat is lighter, cooler, and less expensive due to the lesser amount of cloth... but now I begin to doubt that.

What factors should be considered here other than simply personal preference?

[Chas]

Good graphic, Downunder. Thanks. I've stolen that for future reference.

Regards

Chas

[Downunder Kilt]

Good graphic, Downunder. Thanks. I've stolen that for future reference.

Regards

Chas

That's how I got it Chas, so your welcome

It was actually posted here on a thread some time ago, but by who I don't know. So thanks to the original poster, things like this always tend to come in handy

[M. A. C. Newsome]

Wow! That's a lot of information, Matt. I'm considering a box pleat for my next kilt, and wondering how to choose between all the options. I was thinking I wanted something simpler than a knife-pleat, but now I'm not sure and more than a bit confused.

I hear fellows saying that a box-pleat is lighter, cooler, and less expensive due to the lesser amount of cloth... but now I begin to doubt that.

What factors should be considered here other than simply personal preference?

They are most likely talking about a four yard box pleated kilt. When one compares a four yard box pleated kilt to an eight yard knife pleated kilt, then yes, most definitely the box pleated kilt will be lighter, cooler and less expensive. But all of that has to do with the fact that it is made from four yards of cloth versus eight -- not with the particular style of pleating.

One thing that contributes to confusion is the fact that most kilt retailers and kilt makers keep their offerings fairly simple. For example, at the STM giftshop, we offer our "standard" gent's 8 yard knife pleated kilt; we offer a "casual" kilt made from nominally four yards of cloth; and we offer the traditional four yard box pleated kilt.

So if you are looking just at our on line catalog and what we have listed, you'd assume that a box pleated kilt necessarily is made from four yards, while a knife pleated kilt has eight - unless you opt for the casual style kilt, which is made with less. And that would be true as far as the offerings from our catalog go. But that certainly is not the end of the story.

It helps to think of pleating style and amount of yardage as two independent factors. It is entirely possible to have your kilt made from four, five, six, seven, or eight yards of cloth. And however much cloth is used, you can have it box pleated or knife pleated.

Now, just as when most people say "knife pleated kilt" they intend the eight yard variety, because that is what is most common today, when people simply say "box pleated kilt" (at least here on this forum) they generally intend the four yard variety because that is what was the norm in the early nineteenth century and that's the style that has been revived somewhat.

Note that in certain circles unfamiliar with the current popularization of the traditional four yard box pleated kilt here on X Marks, if you simply say "box pleated kilt" they will assume you are talking about the higher-yardage, modern day military variety.

So when in doubt it always help to be as specific as possible with the details, especially when talking with your kilt maker!