Tartan of the month - September: What do yo see?

[figheadair]

My eyesight isn't what it use to be. Having said that, the blue large squares appear slightly smaller than the large red and green sguares (I use the word square loosely...no pun intended!).

Did James Scarlett blow the thread count?

From my long past tartan weaving days I know that the "Taylor" tread count that was printed in this book is wrong. There may be other errors I'm not aware of.

JDS was indeed wrong. It's B/2 R84 B84 R16 W4 R16 G84 R84 B/2 (half pivot counts).

How did he get it so wrong? Simple, he can't have seen the original and was working from the old records in the Scottish Tartans Society archives.

On to the next (and very obvious) clue:

[Spartan Tartan]

I'll be honest...I felt smart when I thought I saw about 2 and 3/4 of a setting repeat from the original picture. Now, however, NOTHING easy nor obvious to me about this newest picture.

[R.S.Buff]

Originally Posted by R.S.Buff View Post
It looks 18th century to me, even early 18th.

Expand on that thought.

1, Instinct
2.color - madder red ,indigo blue, over dyed light green.
3. simple squares and lines of the set so might be pre-fancy set

herringbone stitch on single fold hem is interesting , I singlefolded the top of the 78th kilt and used a fell stitch.

herringbone weave on selvage points to 18tj early 19th

is it under a clan name or district name?

[xman]

Herringbone edge, yeah. I was wondering. Seems to confirm an 18th c. date.

By the colours in the close-ups, what I thought was a green might actually be intended to be a gold.

[figheadair]

2.color - madder red ,indigo blue, over dyed light green. The red is almost certainly a cochineal red rather than madder. Indigo, yes and a classic 'yuk' green

3. simple squares and lines of the set so might be pre-fancy set Being a simple sett doesn't necessaryily mean that it's older. Look for example at the portrait of Mungo Murray. There are also some extant examples of early C18th busy setts.

herringbone weave on selvage points to 18tj early 19th Almost always C18th.

is it under a clan name or district name?

No

Herringbone edge, yeah. I was wondering. Seems to confirm an 18th c. date. Absolutely

By the colours in the close-ups, what I thought was a green might actually be intended to be a gold.

Definitely green albeit a very olive/khaki shade.

There's more to tease out.

[R.S.Buff]

color - on my monitor the red looks like the most common shade of madder red.
Wilsons of bannockburn seem to always use a very olive shade of green so I would say pre 1750.
NOTE: I like the balance of colors and that shade of ick green is perfect for an 18th cen red based tartan and want to use them in a reproduction for myself.

Herringbone selvedge - The owner of the kilt had some wealth and by the width taller than most.

The Design - I have not seen any modern used set that basic or simple other than the Rob Roy check. It is a design that I would expect a weaver to make just starting to create more complex sets. It is under designed and just not there yet. So I see it as a early version of a more known set. Also the white line between the green and blue stripes looks unique to me.
If I were to change it I would maybe add a smaller green and blue stripe next to the larger ones creating a Robertson type of set. But..

When I visualized the man wearing it I saw someone on the west coast of Scotland, maybe below Skye, and think of a MacDonald. I went to your site and looked at the 18th cen. MacDonald tartans.

I say this is an early version of the MacDonald of Glenaladale set. Put white guards on the blue line and narrow the green band and it is there , and it had the white line between the green and blue band.

[xman]

Herringbone selvedge - The owner of the kilt had some wealth and by the width taller than most.

As stated earlier it is thought that this was a curtain, not a kilt.

[xman]

There's more to tease out.

I notice that the herringbone actually stops and returns to twill weave for several threads in Red at the very edge.

[figheadair]

color - on my monitor the red looks like the most common shade of madder red. Wilsons of bannockburn seem to always use a very olive shade of green so I would say pre 1750.

There is no logic in this deduction. I could easily post something of the same era that has a similar olive green to that which you attribute to Wilsons. Whilst they used that shade they did not invent it.

Herringbone selvedge - The owner of the kilt had some wealth and by the width taller than most.

Taller indeed. The piece is 54.8 x 51.2 inches.

The Design - I have not seen any modern used set that basic or simple other than the Rob Roy check.

By modern I assume you mean woven contemporarily? The Rob Roy is of course mid-C18th at the very latest and almost certainly much older.

It is a design that I would expect a weaver to make just starting to create more complex sets. It is under designed and just not there yet. So I see it as a early version of a more known set. Also the white line between the green and blue stripes looks unique to me. If I were to change it I would maybe add a smaller green and blue stripe next to the larger ones creating a Robertson type of set.

This is not a logical deduction. See my comment under your herringbone quote.

I say this is an early version of the MacDonald of Glenaladale set. Put white guards on the blue line and narrow the green band and it is there , and it had the white line between the green and blue band.

Whilst it's similar there is no evidence to suggest a connection between the two. It's more likely that there are separate settings of a fairly common theme.

[figheadair]

I notice that the herringbone actually stops and returns to twill weave for several threads in Red at the very edge.

Well spotted. So what can you deduce from this and some of the other clues so far?