Skirting Obscenity

[Tartan Tess]

Gads!High school gym shorts back in the 70's.........couldn't be 3" or 4" above your knee.
Womens thigh bones are longer than mens if I rememeber correctly.
Think Billie kilt here. lucky you Xman (measuring her) ha ha
In all seriousness, I am interested to know the final measurements, and how to make the damn thing. I have a goal of making all sorts of types of kilts....tradational, dance, military, box etc.for a Saint Andrews Society exhibition and a billie kilt would be the icing on the cake.

[The Wizard of BC]

Hi X,

From what you give in your post I could not make a skirt that would be guaranteed to fit the way the lady expects.

I would strongly suggest you have the lady take some actual measurements. This would include the length of the Fell.

Let her measure where she wants the waist to fit and where she wants the hem.

Please remember that the top straps of a girls skirt, worn lower than the natural waist, may need to be closer to the top of the kilt than is normal for a man's full rise kilt.

The thing about the Billie type skirts is that there is no Fell to speak of. These types of skirts use a placket to create the taper. Much along the idea of the "V" shaped placket in the back of a pair of blue jeans.
The pleats are sewn into the placket with little or no tapering.

Also, the swish factor is minimal when made with the heavier fabrics of a man's kilt. Most Billie type skirts are made from fabrics 10oz or less. 4 and 5 oz is not uncommon.

[Damocles]

Hi X,

From what you give in your post I could not make a skirt that would be guaranteed to fit the way the lady expects.

I would strongly suggest you have the lady take some actual measurements. This would include the length of the Fell.

Let her measure where she wants the waist to fit and where she wants the hem.

Please remember that the top straps of a girls skirt, worn lower than the natural waist, may need to be closer to the top of the kilt than is normal for a man's full rise kilt.

The thing about the Billie type skirts is that there is no Fell to speak of. These types of skirts use a placket to create the taper. Much along the idea of the "V" shaped placket in the back of a pair of blue jeans.
The pleats are sewn into the placket with little or no tapering.

Also, the swish factor is minimal when made with the heavier fabrics of a man's kilt. Most Billie type skirts are made from fabrics 10oz or less. 4 and 5 oz is not uncommon.

that's what i was going to say about the wait of the fabric less is more in this case as you pointed out if its to heave then it will look stiff and inflexible not draping properly down the hip or over the back but lets face it most mini's look stiff unless there made from vary light wait materials like rayon or lighter twill

[Alan H]

having made a few of these, I have to agree with Steve, especially in terms of the material weight. I've had good luck with Marton Mills PV for womens short skirts.

One little trick.... in a Mans kilt we just measure the length all around, pick one number and start ripping fabric.

That kind of doesn't work with womens skirts, depending on the shape of the woman. I once made a skirt for a woman with...hmmmm....how to put it....rather substantial (strong) buttocks and I measured my usual thing for the fell and drop and cut the material straight. However, the slope of her upper butt, combined with the long curve of the middle butt was SIGNIFICANTLY longer than the straight drop from under her navel to where the kilt hit her on the upper thigh. Upshot was, what seemed just fine from in front was uh...rather "spectacular" from behind.

When I re-made it, I tried a trick...I cut out new material, and the original cut from the flat cloth was straight, like always. But I made that cut with the BACK of the kilt in mind. If I'd left it like that, the front of the kilt would have been too long. What I did was remove about an inch from the cloth where the aprons are, from the waistband area (not the bottom of the kilt) this needs to be "eased in" so that there's not a jagged transition from the tartan pattern in the back to the front.

I don't know if that's clear or not. It worked OK. This was not a billie kilt, obviously...

You've been warned.

[The Wizard of BC]

Alan is totally correct in his making a skirt for a girl shape. It's called slope.

I do this to every kilt I make. If the customer wears his kilt at full rise the slope is minimal.
But the lower the kilt is worn the more important slope becomes.

This is true for people who have lots of shape too.

A lot of kiltmakers look at me weird when I tell them I put slope in a kilt. They have never heard of it before. But if you look at the kilts in the photo that goes around the forum from "The Windsor Style" of the kilts hanging in the closet you will see slope in them.

If my explanation of slope is still not making sense simply put on a pair of jeans and stand sideways in front of a mirror. You will see that the waistband is significantly higher in the back than in the front. This is slope.

[Dixiecat]

Alan is totally correct in his making a skirt for a girl shape. It's called slope.

I do this to every kilt I make. If the customer wears his kilt at full rise the slope is minimal.
But the lower the kilt is worn the more important slope becomes.

This is true for people who have lots of shape too.

A lot of kiltmakers look at me weird when I tell them I put slope in a kilt. They have never heard of it before. But if you look at the kilts in the photo that goes around the forum from "The Windsor Style" of the kilts hanging in the closet you will see slope in them.

If my explanation of slope is still not making sense simply put on a pair of jeans and stand sideways in front of a mirror. You will see that the waistband is significantly higher in the back than in the front. This is slope.

Yes, waist slope or tilt is very common. It can consist of several things, extra length to go over curves, how the body bends in front, how the abdomen is shaped and of course, fashion.

I would say that 98% of people will tilt forwards. Men with full abdomens who wear their belts under the abdomen will have a steeper tilt which is why you'd want to tell your kiltmaker how you wear your kilt. A skirt of someone with a full backside might look like it tilted, but the extra height in the back is the extra length needed to go over the backside.

When I drafted custom sewing patterns we used quite a few measurements for skirts. Front, back and side waist measured to the floor and to the knee, were the most useful not only for finding the waist tilt, but for hem positioning.

To get these measurements, tie a string around the waist or where you'd like the waist to be, measure to the floor or to the knee at the front, back and side seam.

[Alan H]

Regarding slope....intuitively it seems like kind of a no-brainer for a pretty experienced kiltmaker to work that into a solid color, or random-pattern kilt.

However, my two experiences with trying to make a good looking tartan kilt like this were...uh.... "trying" to say the least. I did it, and they looked fine but it wasn't easy.

[Dixiecat]

Hi X,

From what you give in your post I could not make a skirt that would be guaranteed to fit the way the lady expects.

I would strongly suggest you have the lady take some actual measurements. This would include the length of the Fell.

Let her measure where she wants the waist to fit and where she wants the hem.

Please remember that the top straps of a girls skirt, worn lower than the natural waist, may need to be closer to the top of the kilt than is normal for a man's full rise kilt.

The thing about the Billie type skirts is that there is no Fell to speak of. These types of skirts use a placket to create the taper. Much along the idea of the "V" shaped placket in the back of a pair of blue jeans.
The pleats are sewn into the placket with little or no tapering.

Also, the swish factor is minimal when made with the heavier fabrics of a man's kilt. Most Billie type skirts are made from fabrics 10oz or less. 4 and 5 oz is not uncommon.

What you are referring to is called a yoke. Plackets are generally openings such as the opening in the cuff or side of a skirt or front of pants.

[Pleater]

I still have some mini skirts too good to throw away, made of good quality sueded leather.

They would each make quite a good handbag.

The backs are an inch and a half longer than the fronts at the top and curve down to add another inch at the bottom. That is when holding the skirt taut at the top - I'll not get into those again.

It is not uncommon (this being a holiday area) to see women wearing shorts which are obviously new, bought for the holiday, which should really be a good two inches longer at the back.

Anne the Pleater :ootd:

[CopperNGold]

Your friends knows what she wants, and if you wish to keep her as a friend, I would erase the words 'obscene' or 'obscenity' before speaking to her about it. Her taste in clothing may be completely different from your own, and she could be easily offended.

The idea of having her send a skirt of the length she wishes you to make could solve the problem, and then you can decide whether you wish to continue with the job.