Too Traditional?

[David Thorpe]

Striking a balance between "staunchly traditional" and "local crowd-contextual" is probably a good thing. But it's not always easy to find, and can take experimentation.

It seems to me, anecdotally, that the "norm" for dress in general here in the US has followed a downward slope toward hideously casual for a long time. I don't remember when I was a kid seeing people at the grocery store in dirty, torn jeans and tee shirts, nor women with bra straps showing from beneath tank tops, lycra shorts, sweatshirts and sweatpants, flip-flops and the like. I think perhaps this trend has carried over into other situations as well. Church used to mean jacket and tie. Now it seems more come-as-you-are even if you're in your jammies or just finished rotating your tires.
For me, part of the charm of THCD is that it is very conservative in the slow-to-change sense of the term. It recalls a time when people took pride in their appearance in all circumstances outside their front doors.
I am not suggesting that we all should return to Victorian standards, nor legislate fashion police, but criticizing anyone for conforming to basic standards of THCD appropriate to the occasion is ludicrous.
In short, maybe we should be discussing "overly casual" rather than "too traditional".
As always, YMMV.

[Dale Seago]

For me, part of the charm of THCD is that it is very conservative in the slow-to-change sense of the term. It recalls a time when people took pride in their appearance in all circumstances outside their front doors.

That's part of it for me too.

In short, maybe we should be discussing "overly casual" rather than "too traditional".
As always, YMMV.

That might actually be worth a whole 'nother thread.

[CMcG]

...
In short, maybe we should be discussing "overly casual" rather than "too traditional".

That is what the Contemporarily Made Kilts and How to Wear Them sub-forum is for

[auld argonian]

One of the things that looks really strange to me is someone showing up at a Highland Games in 90 (fahrenheit) degree weather dressed to the nines in a tweed jacket and vest and a wool hat. Now I know that's the proper attire but lord have mercy....and I'm not saying scroonch the socks and wear a t-shirt...I get the impression that the wearer feels that they have to show up in everything that they carefully acquired just to prove that they know the ins and outs of the Traditional Highland Dress. Now I have been in situations where the "uniform of the day" was something that was either too warm or too cold for the weather on the day given and most healthy people can survive being in that situation for a few hours but when it's not some kind of mandatory situation, I gotta tell you, sometimes it looks like a guy wearing white tie and tails to a beach party.

Glad to see that someone (STM Gift Shop) is getting the message and offering lighter weight jackets...seeing that so much of the consumption of kilt supplies seems to be centered in the USA, where we generally have a warmer climate than the UK, I am surprised that lighter weight jackets haven't become a staple offering from all the suppliers...that would seem to be where the money is to be made.

Personally, I just try to look like a guy from 2012 wearing a kilt...there are obvious conventions to be observed but I figger you can observe them in a reasonably contemporary way and not look like you're rocking the boat. Obviously those that favor the hard core trad style are gonna carry on regardless but I'll still feel as if they're somehow competing to prove that they "get it"....as Letterman sez: "Ladies and gentlemen, this is an exhibition not a competition...please, no wagering."

Best

AA

[artificer]

One of the things that looks really strange to me is someone showing up at a Highland Games in 90 (fahrenheit) degree weather dressed to the nines in a tweed jacket and vest and a wool hat. Now I know that's the proper attire but lord have mercy....and I'm not saying scroonch the socks and wear a t-shirt...I get the impression that the wearer feels that they have to show up in everything that they carefully acquired just to prove that they know the ins and outs of the Traditional Highland Dress. Now I have been in situations where the "uniform of the day" was something that was either too warm or too cold for the weather on the day given and most healthy people can survive being in that situation for a few hours but when it's not some kind of mandatory situation, I gotta tell you, sometimes it looks like a guy wearing white tie and tails to a beach party.

Glad to see that someone (STM Gift Shop) is getting the message and offering lighter weight jackets...seeing that so much of the consumption of kilt supplies seems to be centered in the USA, where we generally have a warmer climate than the UK, I am surprised that lighter weight jackets haven't become a staple offering from all the suppliers...that would seem to be where the money is to be made.

Personally, I just try to look like a guy from 2012 wearing a kilt...there are obvious conventions to be observed but I figger you can observe them in a reasonably contemporary way and not look like you're rocking the boat. Obviously those that favor the hard core trad style are gonna carry on regardless but I'll still feel as if they're somehow competing to prove that they "get it"....as Letterman sez: "Ladies and gentlemen, this is an exhibition not a competition...please, no wagering."

Best

AA

Truer words rarely spoken, my old bean.

Scotland rarely experiences the WILD swings in temperature that the northern Mid-West of the US deals with. In winter it can easily be -20*F, in summer (Highland Games season, for us) it can easily push upwards of 100*f.
While I've worn the kilt at both extremes, I think it's safe to say that the REST of my apparel probably didn't meet the standards of "traditional Highland" garb.

The reason is quite simple. At -20*f with 40mph winds a tweed jacket isn't going to save me from freezing to death. I wore my thinsulate lined leather pea coat, a thick, high collared sweater (jumper), a tattersall, and an undershirt.

In the same vein, if I'm at the games and it's 95*f with no breeze at all, I'd bake in my outfit if I wore a jacket, much less a waistcoat.

If the Highland Scots had to deal with the environmental extremes we did, I guarantee you that there would be pictures of shepherds in parkas, or, alternately, the 18th C. equivalent of short sleeved polo/t-shirts.

ith:

[creagdhubh]

Personally, I just try to look like a guy from 2012 wearing a kilt...

And may I ask what exactly does that look like? Pretty subjective, I must say.

Cheers,

[CMcG]

...
Personally, I just try to look like a guy from 2012 wearing a kilt...

And may I ask what exactly does that look like? Pretty subjective, I must say.

Seeing as AA has yet to clarify what he means, I'll take a crack at it. Could it mean wearing a kilt in a way that is traditional, but also classic, current, and up to date?

A guy from 2012 wearing the kilt looks like the Duke of Rothesay, particularly when it comes to day wear. I've never seen him looking too traditional and I would say his style is definitely on the more classic side of Highland dress; he is the epitome of personal flair without flamboyance.

Here he is making public appearances. Note that there is nothing superfluous or historical about his attire. The chiefs around him also look fantastic (clan chiefs in general tend to have awesome THCD), but I think Rothesay would be a better example for the Rabble to follow, especially for those of us who are not entitled to wear multiple eagle feathers:



And here is is "off-duty." Traditional but relaxed, this would be a good look for Xmarkers attending more casual daytime events. Note that he's putting his cromach to good use:

[rondo]

In short, maybe we should be discussing "overly casual" rather than "too traditional".

That is what the Contemporarily Made Kilts and How to Wear Them sub-forum is for

Contemporary does not have to mean "overly casual" and frankly I have seen a few contemporary kits that dress up rather nicely. One can dress in a contemporary style and still be quite smart looking [some of 21st Century Kilts offerings come to mind]. I have a made to measure jacket on order, mandarin collar, corduroy fabric, modern cut, it will be quite nice and more fitting for my locale.

I realize this is the THCD forum: I take cues from this forum, but the suggestion that contemporary means "overly casual" is silly. And I do realize that you were tongue in cheek somewhat [with the ]

Rondo

[CMcG]

Contemporary does not have to mean "overly casual" and frankly I have seen a few contemporary kits that dress up rather nicely. One can dress in a contemporary style and still be quite smart looking [some of 21st Century Kilts offerings come to mind]. I have a made to measure jacket on order, mandarin collar, corduroy fabric, modern cut, it will be quite nice and more fitting for my locale.

I realize this is the THCD forum: I take cues from this forum, but the suggestion that contemporary means "overly casual" is silly. And I do realize that you were tongue in cheek somewhat [with the ]

Rondo

Yes, my comment about the Contemporary sub-forum was meant to be a bit tongue in cheek and also a bit sarcastic. Nonetheless, much of the discussion in that forum is overly casual when measured by the standards of THCD. If one wants to discuss wearing a tee shirt and flip flops with their kilt, the Contemporary sub-forum is the place to do it. Sure, modern kilts can -- and do -- get dressed up and people can -- and do -- wear traditional kilts in a contemporary way that is also dressy. But I think the Contemporary sub-forum tends to follow the trend of the last hundred years towards increasing informality of attire versus adhering to more traditional categories like day wear, morning dress, black tie formal, etc.

I look forward to seeing your new jacket over on THAT part of Xmarks

[rondo]

Yes, my comment about the Contemporary sub-forum was meant to be a bit tongue in cheek and also a bit sarcastic...
I look forward to seeing your new jacket over on THAT part of Xmarks

My kilts are mostly Trad [3] or Historic [1] but as someone else mentioned when temps are triple digit [F] it gets a might uncomfortable

Hopefully, I can show contemporary done right...I am looking forward to the new jacket.

Rondo

P.S. Sorry for the derail...please continue.