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9th August 12, 10:00 AM
#11
Originally Posted by Phil
Kilt-wearing is undoubtedly Scottish in origin. Prior to fairly recent times the only kilts you would have seen outwith Scotland would have been local pipe bands or occasional ex-pat Scottish groups having a celebration.
In the last 20 years or so, however, kilts have become more widely worn and examples of this are the various Irish and Welsh tartans which have been created to fill this demand. They have no basis in historical fact, however, and have been created principally to satisfy a desire to wear what is a unique and distinctive form of dress. There are no doubt various reasons for this, some of which it is perhaps best not to go into too deeply. Suffice it to say that highland dress can provide an acceptable alternative to trousers (pants) while providing a robust rebuttal to the inevitable negative responses that unconventional clothing can provoke.
The history of Ireland is a long and circuitous path, full of traps for the unwary, and not really one suited to this Forum, bearing in mind the inevitable pitfalls which are bound to arise due to the entrenched views held by the protagonists of either side. Kilt-wearing, however, has never been a feature of Irish life and is still, to this day, a very marginal thing, usually reserved for the odd wedding. This is a little surprising given the close association between Scotland and Ireland over the centuries. Gallowglasses served as mercenary soldiers with the Irish but their clothing didn’t seem to catch on there. The MacDonalds and O’Donnells were virtually one and the same with close ties between Antrim and the western isles but they did not import kilts to Ireland. The Plantation of Ulster consisted mainly of individuals from the Scottish borders and Ayrshire, none of whom counted kilt-wearing amongst their normal attire so they would not have imported kilts.
Nowadays it is difficult to be dogmatic, however kilts and kilt-wearing are very much seen as the province of pipe bands although these can be found equally across the religious divide there.
***
Thanks
Last edited by cessna152towser; 12th August 12 at 01:43 AM.
Reason: Edited Quote in line with edit to quoted post
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9th August 12, 10:18 AM
#12
Hollywood may have helped with the idea that the Irish wear kilts. Check out the John Wayne movie The Quiet Man. The Duke has his two sons wearing kilts in that movie during the horse race scene.
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9th August 12, 10:47 AM
#13
Like Meghan, my history is somewhat sketchy. I can't remember what I did last week, let alone what others were doing a hundred years ago.
I do recall a response to a post about wearing kilts in Ireland that some Irish perceived the kilt as a sign of English repression and in particular the the tartan of the Black Watch as that regiment served in Ireland during The Troubles. How widespread a sentiment is it? I couldn't say.
On the other hand I am aware of the movement of the Nationalists to try to adopt the kilt, though that apparently predates the period of the Troubles.
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9th August 12, 10:56 AM
#14
Originally Posted by bodhran4me
I do recall a response to a post about wearing kilts in Ireland that some Irish perceived the kilt as a sign of English repression and in particular the the tartan of the Black Watch as that regiment served in Ireland during The Troubles. How widespread a sentiment is it? I couldn't say.
Having been there, maybe I could.
I could also comment on "the kilt as a sign of English repression", but will haud mah wheesht.
However, keeping within forum rules, I will merely clarify that the Black Watch, Gordon Highlanders, Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders, Royal Scots, Scots Guards, Royal Scots Dragoon Guards and the Queen's Own Highlanders are all regiments that saw service in Northern Ireland. It wasn't just the Black Watch.
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9th August 12, 11:20 AM
#15
Originally Posted by Cecil
Hollywood may have helped with the idea that the Irish wear kilts. Check out the John Wayne movie The Quiet Man. The Duke has his two sons wearing kilts in that movie during the horse race scene.
The pipers?
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9th August 12, 11:39 AM
#16
Originally Posted by Tobus
"pan-Celtic" sentimentality
What a great turn of phrase. Well played, Tobus.
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9th August 12, 11:39 AM
#17
Just past the piper scene there at two boys setting by a wagon. One is Patrick Wayne and the other I believe is his brother Micheal Wayne, both are wearing kilts.
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9th August 12, 11:52 AM
#18
The tartan kilt is a Scottish garment. It always has been and will always be seen as such. Having said that, the kilt has been worn by a minority of individuals in Ireland since the reign of Queen Victoria.
In the 19th Century Irish nationalists adopted the kilt as the national costume of Ireland. Men like Patrick Pearse, Sir Shane Leslie, and William Gibson, 2nd Baron Ashborne.
Performers used to wear the kilt for Irish dance competitions. In the 1990s the uniform was changed to black trousers.
The Irish have never had tartans and clans. There are Irish families and Irish kilts, but there have never been Irish clans or tartans. If you spend time on the internet you will see information about Irish clans and tartans but this is baloney.
Currently, in the Irish diaspora, the kilt is worn for St. Patrick's Day dinners and celebrations, ceilis (Celtic dances), and feis (Irish festivals, i.e., Irish Fest). Bagpipers and pipebands wear Irish and Scottish tartan kilts.
In the past, an Irish kilt was always plain or a single solid color. It can be ANY color, but saffron is seen as the most authentic. Black is the most popular. Some wear green or blue on St. Patrick's Day.
Here are three photos of Irish kilts:
Two photos from the 2008 World Irish Dance Competition in Dublin, Ireland:
Here is a publicity photo of Celtic Thunder. You can watch them perform on your local PBS station.
Last edited by kiltbook; 9th August 12 at 11:54 AM.
Reason: Typos
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9th August 12, 12:03 PM
#19
Here is the still from The Quiet Man with John Wayne's sons wearing kilts:
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9th August 12, 01:14 PM
#20
Originally Posted by kiltbook
Here is the still from The Quiet Man with John Wayne's sons wearing kilts:
Wow, that scene looks so un-Irish it boggles the mind.
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