Tie with a Prince Charlie

[OC Richard]

HRH Prince Charles has been seen wearing the Balmoral doublet and not the Kenmore. Even though both doublets appear similar, there is a distinction.

If you're referring to the Kenmore having a stand collar and the Balmoral having an open collar with lapels, note that in the Anderson 1936 catalogue, the Kenmore doublet (which they claim as being their invention) is listed as being available with either sort of collar. So, in the 1930s Anderson was making both styles and calling both "Kenmore" doublets. I don't know why a modern maker would invent a new name for the open-collar Kenmore doublet, but there it is.

BTW the 1936 catalogue I have is not Kinloch Anderson but William Anderson & Sons LTD, 14-16 George St, Edinburgh and 155 Hope St, Glasgow. Did Wm Anderson & Sons become Kinloch Anderson?

[M. A. C. Newsome]

Short answer, yes.

[creagdhubh]

Did Wm Anderson & Sons become Kinloch Anderson?

Yes.

[OC Richard]

So last night my wife and I attended the Black Watch & Scots Guards concert, and I wore kilt, tartan hose, buckled shoes, goathair sporran, Prince Charlie, Argyll waistcoat, stand collar shirt, and long tie. I prefer that look with the PC over the low-cut waistcoat and bow tie... it has a nice Edwardian look to it.

[Tim Little]

No pix, it didn't happen, Richard!
Have to say it sounds interesting, tho.

[JSFMACLJR]

So last night my wife and I attended the Black Watch & Scots Guards concert, and I wore kilt, tartan hose, buckled shoes, goathair sporran, Prince Charlie, Argyll waistcoat, stand collar shirt, and long tie. I prefer that look with the PC over the low-cut waistcoat and bow tie... it has a nice Edwardian look to it.

What is an "Argyll waistcoat"?

[Wil]

What is an "Argyll waistcoat"?

Spot on!

[creagdhubh]

What is an "Argyll waistcoat"?

Sandy,

I'm thinking a 5-6 button front waistcoat with scalloped pocket flaps and three buttons that pairs with its counterpart, the 'Argyll' style jacket with the same style of scalloped pocket flaps with three buttons. Could be wrong, though.

Cheers,

[OC Richard]

Yep it was just a shorthand way to refer to the waistcoat that comes with an Argyll jacket.

I've got to get a tartan waistcoat one of these days! I'm thinking about getting a waistcoat in Black Watch tartan and wearing it with any of my kilts (none of them Black Watch) indiscriminately. I'm thinking of the Black Watch pipers in the 19th century who wore Royal Stewart kilts & plaids with Black Watch tartan doublets, which looked very nice.

Here we were, yours truly, piper Colin (if I recall correctly), my friend and fellow piper Josh Cooper

[CDNSushi]

Back to the original topic of wearing a long tie with a PC jacket...

I've also done this -- in fact, I did it yesterday. Here's my explanation. As much as I would wish it to be otherwise, I just cannot afford to have every bit of kit that would allow me the full freedom to express proper tradition across the full gamut of Highland formalities. I have a grey Argyll, and I have a PC. So I make do.

I wanted to attend my high school students' graduation ceremony following Japanese custom (white necktie, black suit) while incorporating the kilted element as well to express my Canadianness. I've worn my grey Argyll before, but it's really not quite right or appropriate for the occasion, as it's just not formal enough. The school principals generally wear tails with waistcoats, and in this situation, the color is more important than the style, so I opted to wear the PC. I just wore it without the waistcoat. I chose a wingtip collar shirt, because I think they look modern and interesting when worn with a regular tie, with French cuffs. Also, you can't see it in the photo, but the tie is white silk, with a shadow tartan inlay.

So the way I see it, is:

a) that 99% of the world's population (and about 100% of the Japanese population) wouldn't know what a PC was, let alone the way it's usually worn.

b) they really don't care

c) I got zillions of compliments, and even in my own eye, I thought I looked fine.

Anyway. ::