Help (with "setting up" pipes)

[OC Richard]

I have a set of pipes but for the life of me I can't seem to get them to work.

Welcome to the crazy world of piping!

There's a vast amount of lore and skill in "setting up" the instrument itself.

You NEED to get together with an experieced GOOD player... just like a doctor or a car repair person, it is absolutely impossible to diagnose problems over the internet... we can give educated guesses, but guesses they remain!

An experienced player can easily get your pipes to play quite easily in 15 minutes flat. I know, I've done it dozens of times for people. An unknowledgeable person can mess around for hours and get nowhere.

There's an instructional DVD "Pipes Up" that might help... but you must get together in person with an expert!

For example, yes your issue could be with the bag, either the bag itself, or the tie-in of one or more of the stocks, or a crack in one of the stocks, or a problem with the valve, or any one of several other possibilities.

OR it could be the reed! When you mouth-blow a reed it's quite different from when it's just sitting inside the stock, with no lips on it to control it. The reed might be too open, or leaking, or improperly seated in the reed seat.

OR it could be none of these things! Many's the time I've handed my pipes, working perfectly and very efficient, to a non-piper to try, and they've blown and blow until they nearly pass out! This gives the impression that the pipes take a lot of wind, which isn't true. It's about having the correct technique.

An experienced good player could immediately identify your issue, we here online can't! There are just too many different things which could be going on.

Good luck! Richard

[Blupiper]

We pipers are starting to sound like economists: ask five for an answer and get eight answers. *** to OC Richard's answers.

JMB

[Altenberg Bagpiper]

No matter what you do you'll have to get a teacher to learn properly. The instrument is just too complicated. I've met many people who learned on their own without an instructor, usually because they were 'musical' and could learn to play instruments easily. I'm sure that in their own minds they thought they sounded good (you can find numerous examples of this on Youtube). Also, once you learn it wrong it can be very difficult to re-learn it the correct way. Jim

[flyrod6057]

We pipers are starting to sound like economists: ask five for an answer and get eight answers. *** to OC Richard's answers.

JMB

[Eric D Scott]

For what it worth coming from a drummer, I will give pipers the credit they deserve. The great highland bagpipe is definitely a creature that if tamed is an awesome instrument, but if left to its owners own devices, it can be one wickedly evil instrument.

Any piper telling you they know everything is a liar (sorry). The band I am with have members that have been piping for over 60 years, former champions, instructors, etc., teaching and learning is an on going lifecycle.

You mentioned you have a Dunbar chanter ... I feel lucky to have met Mr. Jack Dunbar before he past. He's obviously he was well known in the piping world, but it was nice to know and consider him a friend. Jack travelled with the City of Thorold Pipe Band in 2000 to the Netherlands to celebrate the 55th anniversary of their Liberation. It was a pleasure for the band and Jack.

Sorry for taking this topic off the rails, I just wanted to share.

[OC Richard]

Any piper telling you they know everything is a liar... teaching and learning is an on going lifecycle.

So true!! Next year will be 40 years piping for me, and I'm learning things about reed manipulation all the time, hearing things in other pipers' playing I hadn't noticed before, and so forth.

What I tell beginners is that there are three separate spheres of knowledge which must be acquired to become a decent piper:

1) the manipulation of the fingers on the chanter, which includes the scales, ornamentation, timing, phrasing, musical style (idiom), repertoire, etc, all of which is a lifelong learning process.

2) learning to get a steady tone on the pipes, that is, learning to blow the pipes or bag control, including how to "strike in" and "cut off" which usually takes beginners a few weeks (but which some people never master).

3) the knowledge, skills, and lore concerning the selection, setup, and maintenance of the instrument itself, which includes knowledge of various pipemakers and styles of pipemaking, being able to discern what makes a good bagpipe good, the selection and tying in and seasoning of bags, the skill of hemping joints, knowledge of various styles of valves, knowledge of various Moisture Control Systems and how to install and operate them, knowing how to select and manipulate various types of drone and chanter reeds (including knowing which sorts of reeds suit which instruments), knowing how to tune chanters and drones (which includes knowing about various pitches and approaches to tuning such as Just Intonation and Equal Temperament, that is, the different tuning approaches required for different situations such as playing in a pipe band or playing with a symphony orchestra), etc, all of which is a lifelong learning process.

A fourth category perhaps would be a knowledge of the history of the instrument, famous composers, players, and teachers, a knowledge of the various costumes worn by pipers over the centuries, etc but not included above because these things are not a part of playing the instrument per se.

It's a lot of stuff to know about!

[vmac3205]

Since you are too far from a piping teacher, I might suggest on-line instruction using Skype. There are many really good instructors who teach that way and reach students all over the world. Also, contact Dojo University at Pipersdojo.com
They have a beginning pipe school that is on line.

I would also like to add to the above, if your reed is too stout (hard) you won't get any sound, or you will get two notes before the sound stops and you will pass out.

[Piobair]

I'm a little late to the party, but some observations....

1. Beginners tend to be blowers, in that they equate blowing into the blowpipe with sounding the chanter. And why wouldn't they? PC playing teaches just that. The trick is learning that the bag plays the pipe. Good "blowing" is less about how you fill the bag then how you regulate bag pressure between filling the bag and supplying the reeds with air. I like students to play single, sustained notes on he chanter rather than tunes while they learn to control the pressure. This may be valuable to you if you're still working to get pressure right.

2. The reed may well be too hard. Mouth blowing a reed and bag blowing create two very different amounts of PSI. What seems easy in your hands can be a beast once in the bag. There should be some tips on Dunsire for carving (and wetting/licking) the reed to make it easier, but before you reach for the knife, get a practice chanter adapter so you can play a goose - the bag, sans drones w/ the stocks corked. You'll be able to work on blowing and avian easier time sounding the chanter. A long pc and robust reed will help. The trick is to get off the goose quickly and transition to drones.

I second the Dojo suggestion. I played with many of them under the Dojo's principal instructor Andrew Douglas, and they do indeed know what they're talking about. A local juvenile band has a lot of players using the Dojo program, and it has produced some very talented soloists. If you're serious, check out them out (via Pipers Dojo).

[pbutts]

So how's it going? We need an update.

One other thought from my own experience: how tall are you? I'm 5'6" and I'm thinking very seriously about getting a smaller bag.