Tartan Etiquette

[Antipodean Celt]

In recent decades population mobility has increased dramatically. There are comparatively few these days living in the precise area their ancestors have lived for generation upon generation. There is even a programme on television here in the UK devoted to people discovering from where their families have come. To portray this scenario as the Scotland /the UK v the rest is a serious distortion.

Hi kilted scholar.

You make an excellent point. The danger is over generalisation and it is easy to do.

I think I was saying that the desire to understand one's origins appears to be common to most people (of all cultures), but varies in intensity depending upon a range of factors. One of the strongest is adoption for perhaps obvious reasons. Another is emigration. Yet another is the age of the individual. This stuff bored me silly as a young man when my grandparents tried to tell ne about it. Now that I am middle-aged and a grandfather myself, I am bordering on the obsessive about it. My children of course sigh resignedly as I launch into yet another family story, but perhaps they too will catch the bug as they get older. Such is life.

I certainly wasn't saying that people who still live in the country of their ancestors don't have the desire to trace their family trees. Clearly a huge number do. I was merely observing that the colonial descendants of Scottish and Irish émigrés (on XMTS at least) seem to have a stronger need to 'reconnect' with their ancestry and to PROVE that connection. That leads to the kind of very interesting posts in this thread describing where our ancestors come from and to the phenomenon of the lengthy explanations of origins given by tourists of the old country to friendly locals that Jock Scot originally posted about.

I was certainly not trying to suggest any colonials vs UK theme and I apologise if that impression was given. On the contrary, I think we all have this need to know where we come from to a greater or lesser extent. I just think that the children of émigrés have, IN GENERAL, a greater level of enthusiasm about the topic and the ability to bore the kilts off locals whilst going on and on about it, faded photographs and all (I have some too). Jock Scot's original observation (which is a credit to his patience and tolerance with enthusiastic tourists) is almost a cliche, and it is a cliche because it is so common. I recognise the cliche in myself, as do many other posters. I simply find it interesting that whether we are American, Canadian, Australian, South African, English or whatever, the ideas of reconnecting with our gaelic ancestry, and honouring tradition by wearing the kilt, are incredibly similar.

I think the level of interest in this thread is an illustration of the resonance the issue has for so many of us.

[Leoghan]

i have a question, what if ones only scottish heritage is from his mothers side 3 generations back? that is my case, in fact my last name sounds italian, but i have a kilt in the clan tartan of my on scottish ancestry. i have studied the clan history, along with many others because i love reading on history and such. and wear it out of respect. would that be "offending " anyone?

[MacLowlife]

Leoghan,

I live in the American South- where the population remained fairly static for a couple of hundred years. Most natives here are either English, Huguenot, "Scots - Irish" or African- American, or some combination of 2, 3, or all of the above. The tradition for naming sons is that the first one gets named for his father, the second one gets named for his mother's father, with his father's surname added, and the third one might get named for some more remote ancestor. The notion of naming someone after a character on a soap opera at least used to be completely foreign. Why am I telling you this? Because 3 generations is but a wink of an eye in some places. Part of that "mother's father's name" idea is preserving the connection and association that might otherwise be hidden by the father's name. I am kin to some people (on my father's mother's side) who are frequently called "wuzzas" because they so often will say "My name is ___ but my mother wuzza ( was a ) _____."

So maybe I should call you MacWuzza. In any case, I believe the answer to your question is (or ought to be) a resounding NO.

[Geoff Withnell]

I fail to see why anyone would be offended. Lots of people with last names that aren't the clan name, or one of the septs belonging to the clan in historic times have been members of clans.

i have a question, what if ones only scottish heritage is from his mothers side 3 generations back? that is my case, in fact my last name sounds italian, but i have a kilt in the clan tartan of my on scottish ancestry. i have studied the clan history, along with many others because i love reading on history and such. and wear it out of respect. would that be "offending " anyone?

[Jock Scot]

i have a question, what if ones only scottish heritage is from his mothers side 3 generations back? that is my case, in fact my last name sounds italian, but i have a kilt in the clan tartan of my on scottish ancestry. i have studied the clan history, along with many others because i love reading on history and such. and wear it out of respect. would that be "offending " anyone?

I agree with Maclowlife and Geoff, no one could possibly object to your perfectly sound reasoning. Just do it and please, please avoid the two hour justification lecture!

[Leoghan]

thank you guys. yes when people ask i do give a brief explanation because when i introduce myself at least one person raises and eyebrow and goes "that doesnt sound to scottish." this forum is truely a great place filled with wise people.

[TheOfficialBren]

Plenty of royals throughout history have obtained more than self-assurance about tartan on much shakier ground than your familial connection, sir. I wouldn't bat an eye about it. Wear it proudly and wear it well and you're aces in my bood.

[A Lenape Scot]

My father never new his father. I was told by an a few aunts that his father was Charles Taylor. My grandmother would not marry Charles because he was 20 years older than her and she lied about who my fathers father was because she was still married and embarrassed. This was confirmed by the man who my father is named after. Recently I discovered who this Charles Taylor was and he was born in Scotland, moved the Pennsylvania, and joined the 173rd Canadian Highlanders in 1916. What am I suppose to do now? Wear the Taylor Tartan and join Clan Cameron even though my last name is not Taylor? Am I suppose to stop wearing the other? Things are not always as clear cut as they seem.

[andycwb]

My father never new his father. .... . What am I suppose to do now? Wear the Taylor Tartan and join Clan Cameron even though my last name is not Taylor? Am I suppose to stop wearing the other? Things are not always as clear cut as they seem.

Wear what you bloody well like! Either is perfectly justifiable, so which one feels right? Do you now consider yourself to be a Taylor, or whatever your current last name is?

[Jock Scot]

My father never new his father. I was told by an a few aunts that his father was Charles Taylor. My grandmother would not marry Charles because he was 20 years older than her and she lied about who my fathers father was because she was still married and embarrassed. This was confirmed by the man who my father is named after. Recently I discovered who this Charles Taylor was and he was born in Scotland, moved the Pennsylvania, and joined the 173rd Canadian Highlanders in 1916. What am I suppose to do now? Wear the Taylor Tartan and join Clan Cameron even though my last name is not Taylor? Am I suppose to stop wearing the other? Things are not always as clear cut as they seem.

Can I ask how often you recount your family history in such detail in your day to day life to strangers? Often? Occasionally? Never? Alright at a guess probably never and its not because you are ashamed , its because in real life its, well, because, we just don't. These situations will have occurred in Scotland too, so nothing is new there. Choose your tartan and wear it. Don't overthink all this and get on with your life. If a kilted Scot meets another kilted Scot for the first time, or even the thousandth time, there is never a tartan justification discussion on the details of ones tartan choice.