Tartan Etiquette

[Grizzly]

Short answer yes, welcome aboard from another Taylor - Cameron.

Longer answer - my surname is not Taylor either. I do not have a paternal tartan so my tartan is taken from my maternal line. My mothers maiden name. The Cameron Clan does acknowledge clan members through the maternal line, I have a letter from the Lochiel himself welcoming me in to the Clan when I wrote to him concerning whether Cameron of Erracht was recognised as a clan tartan, but that's another story.

You don't have to stop wearing the other, count yourself lucky that you now have a choice to honour both sides of your family.

What am I suppose to do now? Wear the Taylor Tartan and join Clan Cameron even though my last name is not Taylor? Am I suppose to stop wearing the other? Things are not always as clear cut as they seem.

[Antipodean Celt]

Can I ask how often you recount your family history in such detail in your day to day life to strangers? Often? Occasionally? Never? Alright at a guess probably never and its not because you are ashamed , its because in real life its, well, because, we just don't. These situations will have occurred in Scotland too, so nothing is new there. Choose your tartan and wear it. Don't overthink all this and get on with your life. If a kilted Scot meets another kilted Scot for the first time, or even the thousandth time, there is never a tartan justification discussion on the details of ones tartan choice.

Hi Jock,

I know you have strong feelings on the issue of 'justifying and explaining your tartan'. I appreciate you don't feel the need to do either. I also understand that you do not understand why other people, particularly descendants of émigrés, have the need to explain and justify their choices. Your own anecdotes reveal that you know that people do feel the need to explain and justify. We have done our best to explain the reasons for that, but I appreciate that you still don't comprehend the need or perhaps you feel that people should show more discretion.

Either way, I completely respect your views. I do not seek to change them. You are entitled to your opinions.

I do, however, ask you to respect posters who do have that need. People who, in good faith, post their stories looking for a friendly ear and some validation for their choices.

I infer from your posts that listening to such stories is not the best use of your time. Consequently, can I please ask that you not read them? If you do perhaps read such a story by mistake, then can I ask you to not comment in the way you have above? Dignified silence or perhaps some more supportive words along the lines of 'choose your tartan and wear it' would be welcome.

Thanks and all the best,

John

[English Bloke]

Cameron of Lochiel Hunting ancient...

Now there's a kilt with some "pretty colours" in it !!



I do believe this debate will rumble on and on and on ad infinitum. Interesting to see how people's lack of character is implied by the choices they make regarding the Kilts they wear. Yet the same people doing said judging get all huffy when their own justifications are countered.

Perhaps we should all endeavor to be less blinkered and critical... maybe. Be more willing to accept, and dare I say, allow the opinions of others in these exchanges. I find the patronising and holier-than-thou use of "just because you can, doesn't mean you should" makes me want to explode into into a frenzy of profanity. It smacks of sneering and a refusal to accept that others are entitled to walk a different path. That said, it's another's opinion so I apologise in advance for this totally hypocritical missive.

Kilt on people. We're all in this together!!

[English Bloke]

I'm with Jock on this actually. It's a two way street. Clearly Jock and I have a radically different approach to kilting. He's a one Kilt chap (he tells fibs you know, he's got three) and I'm obviously not. He does however go to great pains to advise us all on how things are perceived and conducted in the Highlands, the home of the Kilt. Sometimes for us 'foreigners', this may be an uncomfortable truth but it is how it is.

I don't believe at any time he's having a dig at anyone either directly or indirectly. I read his posts as a neutral outsider and I take no inference that he's pointing them at me or anyone else. I know for a fact he finds my approach to the Kilt, mind bogglingly bizarre but despite that I will continue to do what I do, because I like doing it. I've heard his opinion. I respect his opinion. I will adjust my approach to suit the environment if I'm ever in his locale, but otherwise, it makes no difference to me where I live and Kilt.

If you don't like Jock's message, ignore it. If you think it's baiting, don't rise to it.

[Phil]

I infer from your posts that listening to such stories is not the best use of your time. Consequently, can I please ask that you not read them? If you do perhaps read such a story by mistake, then can I ask you to not comment in the way you have above? Dignified silence or perhaps some more supportive words along the lines of 'choose your tartan and wear it' would be welcome.

Thanks and all the best,

John

So there you are, Jock. Your views are not just to be ignored now but you have actually not to even bother reading posts from the likes of this antipodean fellow. I always heard that our "down under" people were uncommonly rude but this really does take the biscuit.
I think he fails to realise that in our country kilt-wearing is not regarded as in any way peculiar and that no-one would be so brash as perhaps another antipodean to enquire as to your right to wear such a garment.
I really am beginning to wonder why you bother trying to explain things to the likes of such people when the saying "none so blind as those who will not see " comes to mind

[Grizzly]

Cameron of Lochiel Hunting ancient...

Now there's a kilt with some "pretty colours" in it !!



I do believe this debate will rumble on and on and on ad infinitum. Interesting to see how people's lack of character is implied by the choices they make regarding the Kilts they wear. Yet the same people doing said judging get all huffy when their own justifications are countered.

Perhaps we should all endeavor to be less blinkered and critical... maybe. Be more willing to accept, and dare I say, allow the opinions of others in these exchanges. I find the patronising and holier-than-thou use of "just because you can, doesn't mean you should" makes me want to explode into into a frenzy of profanity. It smacks of sneering and a refusal to accept that others are entitled to walk a different path. That said, it's another's opinion so I apologise in advance for this totally hypocritical missive.

Kilt on people. We're all in this together!!

Is that the T4L Cameron Ancient variant John? I have looked at that many times myself. It's a bargain at the moment for £169 for an 16oz 8 yarder made to measure.

[Jock Scot]

Antipodean Celt.

I have to confess that I am somewhat nonplussed at your post. Not upset I hasten to add. In real life, out on the street do you tell complete strangers the intimate details of your pedigree? Well not me or my friends and acquaintances do and I suspect not many out in the wide world do either. Its not that there is anything to be ashamed of, possibly there is a lot to be very proud of, but these are private matters that just do not in my experience get talked about with strangers. Normally.

Now a website such as this is slightly removed from the world on the street and does allow people to ask questions even quite personal ones without criticism with like minded members, and helpful, I had hoped, answers given . I am sorry that you have read into my reply given here a few posts ago something that I certainly did not intend, but I hope on reflection that you can see the difference between a website and the world on the street.

Frankly I do find it very odd that complete strangers from outwith Scotland(I have never had such a conversation with a Scot) come up to me-----and others------ and want to discuss in detail their ancestry, does it not occur to them that I/we may have other things to do with our time? However, they are nice people generally and I do try to at least give them a few minutes (hours sometimes!) and as I think I have said before, I do not begrudge them my time because they are nice people.

[English Bloke]

Err... it might be...

I haven't got a picture of the back to hand but it's pleated to a compact sett, so it actually appears pleated to various stripes About 30 pleats, 3 red, 1 block, 1 yellow, 1 block, 3 red, 1 block etc.. which is exactly what I asked for.

The red isn't actually red, it's more of a "salmon pink" (as the man from T4L explained it when he rang me). It's very well constructed (machine sewn) and the email, phone calls and general effort by them to ensure I got what I wanted were outstanding. It's a beautiful kilt which I am proud to wear, despite my lack of connection to the Cameron family name.

173 quid delivered for made to measure... It's worth a punt if you can make the allowance in your budget.

I used to post my growing collection of kilt acquisitions on here but I don't now. I got the distinct impression it irked some folk so I stopped.

[Antipodean Celt]

So there you are, Jock. Your views are not just to be ignored now but you have actually not to even bother reading posts from the likes of this antipodean fellow. I always heard that our "down under" people were uncommonly rude but this really does take the biscuit.
I think he fails to realise that in our country kilt-wearing is not regarded as in any way peculiar and that no-one would be so brash as perhaps another antipodean to enquire as to your right to wear such a garment.
I really am beginning to wonder why you bother trying to explain things to the likes of such people when the saying "none so blind as those who will not see " comes to mind

Hi Phil,

I was trying very hard not to be rude. My apologies if you perceive me to have been rude in any way.

I respect absolutely Jock's views and your own. I do not seek to impose my views on either of you.

I merely ask that if people ask for some support in their choices, that they are, in fact, supported. Sharing such personal stories is difficult and sensitive. I am reminded of what my grandmother used to say: If you don't have anything nice to say, then don't say anything.

All the best,

John

[Jock Scot]

So there you are, Jock. Your views are not just to be ignored now but you have actually not to even bother reading posts from the likes of this antipodean fellow. I always heard that our "down under" people were uncommonly rude but this really does take the biscuit.
I think he fails to realise that in our country kilt-wearing is not regarded as in any way peculiar and that no-one would be so brash as perhaps another antipodean to enquire as to your right to wear such a garment.
I really am beginning to wonder why you bother trying to explain things to the likes of such people when the saying "none so blind as those who will not see " comes to mind

"When the going gets tough, the tough get going" I used to be told, but I do wonder at times!