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  1. #1
    Join Date
    10th October 08
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    I've done a fair amount of reading on protocols for this sort of thing, as I'm involved in the Boy Scouts of America and we occasionally do a few ceremonies, some even with international representatives. (I did some research for a young man who asked for guidance in performing the duties of an honor guard for flag raising/lowering.)

    In the U.S., it is customary upon the playing of the U.S. National Anthem (currently The Star-Spangled Banner) to stand and face the U.S. flag (or the source of the anthem when it is being played if no flag is present). See United States Code (USC) Title 36 etc. re: National Anthem for a full description. (Steve has previously noted a Wikipedia article reference, the site I referenced is the online respository of the actual code.)

    I have found it to be respectful to stand quietly and remove one’s headgear at the playing of other nation's national anthems as well. It’s not necessary (or expected, unless you’re a citizen of that nation) to salute or ‘render honors’ to their colors.

    As far as dipping flags go (as part of ‘rendering honors’), again, check out the USC (this time, Title 4, chapter 1, section 8). The U.S. flag is never dipped (especially not while in the U.S.), unless it is the ensign (the U.S. flag flying on a ship) responding to a salute from a ship of a foreign nation. State or other organization's flags may be dipped in salute.
    Last edited by EagleJCS; 21st August 13 at 12:45 AM.
    John

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  3. #2
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by EagleJCS View Post
    As far as dipping flags go (as part of ‘rendering honors’), again, check out the USC (this time, Title 4, chapter 1, section 8). The U.S. flag is never dipped (especially not while in the U.S.), unless it is the ensign (the U.S. flag flying on a ship) responding to a salute from a ship of a foreign nation. State or other organization's flags may be dipped in salute.
    Dipping the ensign is, I'm afraid, another tradition that is going by the wayside. Few merchantment continue the practice due to skeletally thin crews and warships the world over have deck officers who are terrified of flubbing the procedure!

  4. #3
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    21st July 11
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    National Anthem etiquette

    Thanks everyone for all of the good information.

    As a veteran, this was of particular interest to me:
    members of the Armed Forces and veterans who are present but not in uniform may render the military salute in the manner provided for individuals in uniform
    I had a very vague memory of something like this, but I thought it was just retired vets. Thanks Steve for clearing it up.

  5. #4
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    27th September 04
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    As a US Navy veteran, I face the flag (or the music if no flag is displayed) and stand at attention when our anthem, or any others is played. As for dipping our colors, US Navy vessels never dip their colors, unless another vessel dips their's first.
    "A day spent in the fields and woods, or on the water should not count as a day off our allotted number upon this earth."
    Jerry, Kilted Old Fart.

  6. #5
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    I REALLY REALLY like the new law that allows Veterans to salute the U.S. Flag in civies. I much prefer to salute the flag. It feels good. A salute is much more meaningful to me than the hand over the heart or standing at attention alone.

    Appreciate the post Steve, had thought one had to be covered to salute the flag in civies but apparently not.

    Just my mind, my opinion, but the salute says so much more and means a lot to me. And that is what I've been doing since I heard about the new regs a few years ago.
    Ol' Macdonald himself, a proud son of Skye and Cape Breton Island
    Lifetime Member STA. Two time winner of Utilikiltarian of the Month.
    "I'll have a kilt please, a nice hand sewn tartan, 16 ounce Strome. Oh, and a sporran on the side, with a strap please."

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  8. #6
    Join Date
    22nd July 08
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    I noticed that the US Flag Code calls for all in attendance to place their hand over their heart, making no mention of the origin of the people. I would assume then, that means even non-US citizens would be expected to do so... For example, tourists from another country at an American baseball game... Is that a correct assumption? If so, would that also apply to non-US dignitaries in attendance?

    When I was in Japan, I would always stand and face the Japanese flag during the playing of the Kimigayo, but I would not sing with those present, as I didn't feel it would be appropriate. Plus, there was (and still is) a LOT of political contention about playing the anthem at official school events. The two sides are very polarized and I didn't wish to make a political statement one way or the other.

  9. #7
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    18th December 11
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    no, the only persons required to place their hand over their heart are citizens of the country being honored. In the U.S. non-citizens are not required or expected to salute or place their hand over their heart during the U.S. National Anthem
    proud U.S. Navy vet

    Creag ab Sgairbh

  10. #8
    Join Date
    25th November 09
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    Lomita, CA (via Boston, MA)
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    Quote Originally Posted by CDNSushi View Post
    When I was in Japan, I would always stand and face the Japanese flag during the playing of the Kimigayo, but I would not sing with those present, as I didn't feel it would be appropriate. Plus, there was (and still is) a LOT of political contention about playing the anthem at official school events. The two sides are very polarized and I didn't wish to make a political statement one way or the other.
    JIM: I am not asking for a position, just a neutral explanation, but why would playing a National Anthem at a school event be controversial? One would think that good citizenship would be core to a school's mission. It seems a bit different. Something akin to a Japanese variation of Church and State?

    P.S. I hope you don't find it disrespectful but as an avid hockey fan I routinely join in "O Canada", and by complete happenstance was in a New Zealand pub some years ago when a rugby tournament was on. Team members and supporters from the different nations spontaneously, and with the aid of a few pints, started each singing their national anthems. The sole Canuck, started to falter as he sang solo, with great chagrin, after other nations had numerous participants so I helped out to finish for which he was extremely grateful.
    Last edited by seanachie; 21st August 13 at 07:13 PM.

  11. #9
    Join Date
    10th April 13
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    Actually, an American X Marker might be able to help me out here? I was in New York with my family in March 2008. We saw the Rangers play the Penguins at Madison Square Gardens. When the national anthem was sung there were a few boos from the crowd. We never understood why. I'm not sure if there was a statement being made about political events at the time, in NY or elsewhere?
    Steve.

    "We, the kilted ones, are ahead of the curve" -
    Bren.

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