Sewing machine advice wanted

[Benning Boy]

I'm looking for a simple sewing machine to use for kilt making, and sometimes sewing outdoor gear. I can get a Pfaff 6 and cabinet for free. Does anyone know anything about the machine? I'd like recommendations of machines to search for. I would guess I'd need something capable of sewing through several layers. Are there good but common models I should be looking out for?

[Chas]

From what I can see on-line the Pfaff 6 is a commercial model and is considered 'heavy duty'. It should be able to deal with multiple layers.

[Spartan Tartan]

Fantastic question!! I am VERY interested to see some responses. I have been wanting a sewibg maching for a long tine, but do not know what to look for. Eventually, I figure i will end up spending time in the shop with someone trying to figure out what would be best for me.

[ratspike]

A quickie Google search tells me that Pfaff is old and made out of metal parts, which is exactly what you want, and you can't beat the price. If it's anything like the older machines I've sewn with it'll have a nice, high presser foot lift and will sew through just about anything you can get under the needle. I think it'll be a lovely machine to make kilts with. It should do pretty well for outdoor gear as well, though you may want to pick up a walking foot.

Spartan Tartan, anything that's older and made with all metal parts will be a good starting point. The various Kenmore 158 models are very highly regarded and not hard to find. Prices will range from free to a few hundred bucks.

A note about "heavy duty" and "industrial strength". The way those terms are used with sewing machines are really misleading. These vintage domestic machines are made with all metal parts and they'll generally run forever if you maintain them well. They'll usually sew through just about anything with the right needle. For this kind of sewing in particular I think a vintage machine is a fabulous choice, but it's still a domestic sewing machine. Nothing industrial or commercial about it, and that's totally fine.

[sydnie7]

If the Pfaff is running, you've scored a great deal. I might invest the $60 or so that a local sewing machine shop will charge to clean and tune it up. If it doesn't come with a user manual, look for one online -- it should show you where the machine may need periodic oiling, tell you what range of needle and thread sizes it accepts, other good info.

I recently splashed for a new Janome and really like it. Had hopes for a "vintage" machine that had been in someone's garage for 30-odd years, but it turned out to be too corroded inside to repair. Wishing you better luck!

[usonian]

If the machine works, I would jump on it in a heartbeat! And then spend the money to have someone give it a once-over. It may not be industrial, but old solid-metal domestic machines like this are wonderful, and should certainly be able to handle multiple layers of fabric... even heavier stuff like canvas for making bags.

It's definitely always worth poking your head into thrift/charity shops; you never know what you might find if the timing is right. Last month I stumbled across a 1953 Necchi BU Mira sewing machine and hand-built cabinet in a thrift shop. I wasn't familiar with the brand and don't know much about sewing machines in general, but one look at this machine from across the room and I could tell it was 1) Well-maintained and 2) Built like a tank. I asked if I could plug it in at the store, and the thing ran smooth as silk and soft as butter. I took it home for $50 and apart from replacing a small length of electrical cord, all it needed was a good cleaning and oiling. It's a domestic machine, but from what I've read it was top of the line in its day and from what little I've used it so far it feels like it will sew through just about anything I throw at it.


Hello Beautiful by Usonian, on Flickr

[The Wizard of BC]

I am guessing that myself Rocky are the biggest users of machines on the forum with Regina not far behind. I have four Pfaff 138-6 machines in my shop and they run all day long, 5 days a week. Here are some things I have learned.

Don't listen to the sales hype about how many layers of leather a machine will sew through that is actually an old sewing machine salesman's trick. Almost any machine will sew through as much leather as you can slide under the pressure foot with the proper needle. If you are going to be making Kilts in the modern style you will very seldom be sewing through leather. If you are thinking about sewing leather then go for a dedicated leather machine with a walking foot.

The biggest thing to look for is how high the pressure foot will lift. One of the differences between an industrial machine and a domestic machine is that almost everything is adjustable and repairable. My machines have been adjusted till the pressure foot will lift a full 1/2". This then requires longer needles and a bit of technique to use.

When sewing kilts in the modern style you will be dealing with multiple layers of fabric. Sometime 10-12 layers. There are times when I need almost the full 1/2" clearance just to get all of that fabric under the pressure foot. It does not take much 'omph' to get through those layers but 90% of the machines out there can't get the pressure foot high enough.

So just what is an industrial sewing machine. Well the first and most noticeable difference is the knee lift pressure foot. You lift the pressure foot by pressing on a lever with your right knee. This allows you to keep both hands on your work.
The second is the speed that an industrial works at. When I bought my machines they were set to make 4000 stitches a minute. You can't even see the needle at that speed. I have mine slowed down as far as they can go and they can still go faster than you can think.
The third is the motor. Most industrial machines use a clutch motor. You turn the motor on at the start of the day and continues to run and hum all day long. The electricity bill is outrageous and the noise a constant hum in the background all day long. I converted mine to electronic speed control motors. $500.00 per machine for new motors.

And finally Industrial machines are usually designed to do one specific thing, To do that one thing all day long for years and years. If you have a button hole machine it will make the exact same perfect button hole for 40 years but that is all it will do.

So here is my list of what to consider before you jump into sewing kilts by machine.

1) Do you have a local sewing machine repair guy who knows your particular machine? I'm not talking about the local sewing retail shop. They will know about quilting and machines with a million electronic fancy stitches but most will know very little else. Today's retail sewing shop is geared towards selling the most expensive machine to people who don't know anything and to ladies who want to make fancy quilts and other household items.
You need that old guy who has been around a long time and has a garage full of parts and years and years of experience. Someone willing to teach you how to use, and maintain you machine. Without this old guy to fix your machine and to adjust it you are going to be able to sew only till the first thing goes wrong. Then you are back buying another machine.

2) Get the most general or universal machine you can find. Preferable one that can do forward and reverse straight stitches and a good wide zig-zag stitch and nothing else. No fancy stitches and no electronics. You want at a minimum a 6mm or 3/8" zig-zag stitch and a long 4 or 5 mm straight stitch. That's all you need. Everything else is just a waste. Never fool yourself that buying a walking foot machine is a good deal if you will not be sewing your own sporrans. A walking foot is for sewing multiple layers of leather and they do not sew fabric well at all.

3) Get a machine that is designed to be repairable. My Pfaff's were the industry standard for over 50 years. millions of them were made but that model is no longer made and repair parts are getting hard to find. Repair parts for these machines can cost a pretty penny. Sometimes it is cheaper to junk it and find another one. If I were looking to buy machines today I would go with the White brand.
Try to stay away from any machine with a computer if possible. Electronic speed controls are OK, I'm talking about the computer that gives you all the fancy stitches. Yes they are great for what they are but usually do so many different things that they don't do any one thing perfectly. And computers will break just like mechanicals but are not repairable. The are designed to be thrown away and replaced.

4) Spend some time at your local high school or tech College talking to what used to be called the home economics teacher. Learn how to use these machines. There is a rather long learning curve. You don't just sit down at a sewing machine and go to it. Learn how to adjust your machine and how to match needles to thread and thread to the job. Learn how to thread and adjust the tensions. Learn how to make it go and make it stop. It isn't just smash your foot down and stitch. You need to get a feel for your machine and learn how to sew arrow straight stitch lines and perfect curves.

5) Avoid any machine that has been sitting in somebody's garage for a while. Or one that is offered as "It seems to run smooth", or "it was working fine that last time I plugged it in". These are pretty good signs that the person who owned the machine did not know how to use it and it has been sitting, rusting since they got frustrated. You want to find a machine that is in daily use, well oiled, and maintained.
Without the old sewing machine repair guy in point one these machines will just be a headache for days till you give up in frustration and go looking for another.
(Oh, and old industrial machines are supposed to be oily. They do not run without being oiled. That is why there is a drip pan under the machine. It sometime feels like you should just pour a gallon of oil all over the machine and let it soak in. Dripping oil is a good thing.)

6) And my final note. Be prepared to spend money on a variety of different needles, a dedicated tool set and accessories. You may get the machine for very little money but all the other stuff to sew a kilt can cost almost as much as another machine. learn what needles you machine uses and where to buy them. Buy them in bulk, 25 and 50 at a time. I have on average 100 needles for my four machines in four different thicknesses and three different points. I have 8 types of thread. (Not color, type of thread)
I have almost as much money invested in the extras as I do for the motors I replaced.

If you have any specific questions I'll try to help. You have but to ask.

[Rick Y]

My suggestion? Find that old neighborhood sewing machine repairman, tell him/her what you want/need and see if he/she has a refurbished one sitting there waiting for you.

[artificer]

One other issue I wanted to add to Steve's fantastic breakdown is this - NEVER buy a machine that has a maximum capacity that's right where you'll be working (ie if it can sew 5 layers of canvas and you'll REGULARLY be sewing 5 layers of canvas).

Machines don't like to be run at maximum tolerance. It can cause premature wear on the internal workings.

Here's my leather machine, which has a maximum capacity of 7/8" of Veg-Tanned leather.

DSC09044.jpg
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My NORMAL maximum is somewhere around 1/2", with most pieces running much thinner.

I run 3 primary needle and thread sizes.

ith:

[Benning Boy]

Thanks so much to all for the input. You've been a great help. I'm going to take he Pfaff, since it belongs to a very close friend and I sorta feel obligated now to get it. However, just this morning, I checked the local Craig's List and found a White 465 and cabinet for sale. It's from 1969 and all metal. It does straight and zig-zag stitches and embroiders, and all the original parts and accessories and manual are there. I'm going to take a look at it. I think it may be just what I need.