I need some advice about my vintage sporran please

[duartgirl]

Hello! I am new to this website, but given the wealth of knowledge that that is represented here, I am hopeful that someone can answer a few questions for me.

When we went to the Scotland a couple of years back, my little boy (now 7) wanted "something Scottish" to wear to the Maclean Centenary gathering. A kilt was not in the budget, but we did find this broken sporran in a charity shop in Inverness. Since it was so cheap I put it in his dress-up box and he has slain many dragons in the backyard wearing it. Long story short, last year he wore it to a highland games here in the Seattle area and a gentleman suggested that it might be over 50 years old and might be worth trying to fix up. I know nothing about sporrans, so I am hoping to get some opinions.

The front of is made of a reddish glossy fur and the back is a red leather with a little bit of tooling. The fur and the leather are in good shape, but they have separated from each other on the sides. There are no names or markings on the leather or the brass. The frame (?) is made of brass with a steel piece on the inside where it closes. The closure is really neat. It screws down to lock the mechanism so that it won't open. The broken part is on the inside. The solder (?) on the thin brass piece that attaches the fur to the frame has come off in two places.

So...here are my questions;

1) How old is it? It doesn't seem very likely that I would find a sporran over 50 years old in a charity shop, but I really have no idea.
2) Is the frame even fixable? If so, do I replace the fur and leather also?
3) Given the answers to 1 and 2, is it worth messing with, or is the expense to fix it up more than it's worth?

Thanks in advance for your input!IMG_2980.jpgIMG_2979.jpgIMG_2976.jpg

[Downunder Kilt]

Hi duartgirl, welcome to the forum. Your sporran could well be 50 years old, the latching mechanism is a modified version of one used since the 1700's. The repair thin brass piece is not a costly one, either replacement of the broken rivets or silver soldering them back together. The cantle by itself is worth in the vicinity of 200 dollars (possibly more). As for the fur and leather separating on the sides, I know someone will be able to advise a fix for that.
If you decide to replace the bag, I would suggest you contact Artificer (see his ad on the bottom advertiser bar on each page of the forum)
If you can put up a couple more photos it would give us more information to guide our responses to your questions. Cheers

[artificer]

As Downunder Kilt said, It's difficult to tell the age of a sporran like this right off the bat. This same basic shape and mechanism has been around quite a long time, and it's not uncommon for a cantle to have been rebagged more than once in it's long life. The fact that it screws shut means that it's probably not hundreds of years old, but it could easily be 50-100 years old. I'd like to see a picture of the backside of the sporran.

In your second shot it appears that there is some writing on the inside lip partially obscured by the fur. This may be from the maker. I've a piece with similar markings (what appears to be a style/model # and some maker's notes about finally fitting) sitting on my bench right now.

As to the repair, it looks like the rivet has simply snapped off at the peening (where the rivet is hammered out to widen and lock in place). From your 3rd picture it looks like the rivets have flat heads, so it shouldn't be TOO much work to either remove the rivet and hammer/stretch the shaft a bit so that it may be re-peened or even just replace the entire rivet.

ith:

Edit: BTW - and if your wee lad is still interested in a kilt, you might wish to check out Stillwater Kilts for a very affordable kilt for growing boys. They run around $25, and their link can be found in at the advertiser's bar on the top of the page.

[McMurdo]

I'm glad Artificer has chimed in he makes wonderful sporrans and knows more about this than a lot of people.
Good luck with it.

[duartgirl]

IMG_2982.jpgIMG_2983.jpgIMG_2988.jpgIMG_2989.jpgWow, I am learning a lot about sporrans already! There is a mark in ink -/A 451-. The metal frame (cantle ?) appears to be hand done as it is not a uniform thickness. I tried to show the where the fur and leather have separated. It appears to just be the threads that have given out and I could probably fix that myself. Any idea what type of fur it is?

I am shocked that it could possibly be worth $200. Is it because the frame is brass?


Thanks again for the advice! I am going to check out those little guy kilts...he would love one.

[Nathan]

That sporran is lovely! What are the dimensions, if you don't mind my asking? The reason it has some value isn't just because it's made of brass. Functional brass cantles of that nature aren't mass produced and are rarely made nowadays. Because of their classic look and relative rarity, they are desirable to those kilt wearers who want to evoke the classic look of a bygone era and who don't want to have the same sporran as 10 other gents at the party. Although difficult to tell from photos alone, the fur and leather look to be in decent enough shape so they may just require some careful stitching with the proper thread and tools. If that's possible, this would be a better option than replacing the entire bag.

[davidlpope]

Very nice. The fur looks to be otter. These sporrans, and modern "one-offs" in this style are popular because they break out of the cookie-cutter mold and evoke a bygone era when men's clothing was more more individualized. Very nice find, although I'm shuddering thinking about your little boy rolling around in the sandbox with it. If you're keen to part with it, PM me.

[ASinclair]

Hello, duartgirl!



If you haven't done so already, you may want to introduce yourself in the Newbie forum.

[duartgirl]

Thanks for all the info! The dimensions of the canticle are about 6 3/4 in (17cm) from the ends of each of the knobs left to right and about 4 in (10cm) from the top of the closure to that left/right line (if that makes any sense!), and about 9 1/2 inches from the closure to the bottom of the bag. Is this smaller than most sporrans nowadays?

[artificer]

Thanks for all the info! The dimensions of the canticle are about 6 3/4 in (17cm) from the ends of each of the knobs left to right and about 4 in (10cm) from the top of the closure to that left/right line (if that makes any sense!), and about 9 1/2 inches from the closure to the bottom of the bag. Is this smaller than most sporrans nowadays?

Sounds like your sporran is right about modern sized.

Very early ones were in some cases quite tiny. I had one for refurb that was about 5.25" across the mouth of the cantle and was sand-cast bronze.

Later Victorian ones got almost grotesquely large- in some cases over 7" wide (not counting the knobs, just the actual arc of the cantle),

Your top-to-bottom height is also almost bog-standard for modern sporran dimensions.

To re-attach the fur to the bag back a whip stitch was commonly employed (assuming that the fur wasn't sewn under the rear trim strip, which would be Standard, if there weren't a gusset employed).

If you were planning to to the repair yourself, get the heaviest thread you can get from your local sewing/fabric store, and drag it across a bit of beeswax.

Double it up and away you go.

It won't be entirely 'to-spec' but as long as you go at least an inch or so past the point of separation you should stop the continued breakdown of the piece.

It's a lovely piece, and certainly something your son can grow into for basically his whole life, assuming it survives the costume box years.
(Personally, I'd recommend you remove it from the costume box and replace it with a cheapy sporran you can buy on eBay for $12-16US. He'll thank you for it later)

ith: