You may not take me to dinner dressed like that

[Dixiecat]

Other than not wearing a jacket, I don't see what your mother had to complain about. You look very nice and since the Maple Leaf is my favourite tartan, you look more than nice. But, mom's are moms and see things different. I think your choice of doing what she wants while making sure she doesn't overpay is wise and respectful.

[Sean D]

No offence taken , Sailor , I know of cream or oatmeal colour ( yes I put the u in ) bieng regarded as formal hose or even diced I am not sure who other than the kilt hire companies decided to have white hose , the same as who decided to make ghillie brogues the formal dress shoe , buckle brogues yes , maybe the white was chosen to show off the criss cross laces of the ghillie brogues for what purpose I can't understand . As far as I am aware the correct hose to wear formally is diced hose but I don't have 2 grand spare to purchase some . In SA all the functions I attend , St Andrews evening , Burns etc I have not seen white hose at all mostly oatmeal colour and not one pair of ghillie brogues and most if not all those gentleman are all expats born in Scotland .

[MacRobert's Reply]

I know about the Great White Hose Debate, but what is the issue surrounding black hose?

Just not traditional. A bit like the white hose that hire shops introduced, one colour goes with everything. Hire shops now often stock black hose to go with everything. I suppose ruch ties and five-button waistcoats with PCs are the latest hire shop fads.

Those who have not grown up with the kilt tend to trust the hire shops to be correctly dressed and, even when purchasing their own clothing, model the look they have seen with the hired clothing. It's a kind of hire shop hegemony.

[Sean D]

Mac , I have seen the 5 button waistcoats and ruch ties worn with the prince charlie ,I know its not traditional but many ex pat scots gentlemen who saw it gave it a " looks sharp " approval . I am getting married one day in my Davidson tartan kilt and was wondering what type of doublet or jacket to use , as it is a late afternoon early evening wedding followed by an evening reception at the moment its quite a distance in the future , I would like to stay as close to tradition as possible , but don't want to do what everyone else does which is black bow tie and 3 button waistcoat with the pc , however a montrose is out due to the fact the wedding will be in october and in South Africa in October its heading for summer and of course my band doublet is not suitable at all . Any suggestions ?

[McMurdo]

Sean D.
I would say an Argyll will fit the bill, you may want to go for a Black Barathea jacket with silver buttons but you could also go for a Tweed jacket with bone buttons, that is up to you of course, for myself I wore a Charcoal Tweed for my wedding. I really do not like the ruche tie 5 button waistcoat with a Prince Charlie look, to me it just does not look right. Perhaps you should start a new thread about it.

[OC Richard]

Well Farmer Jones, my wife would probably have the same reaction. Or at least said something like "you're going to wear that, really?"

Now, we have eaten at restaurants a number of times when I've been kilted, but it's always been on the way home from some Scottish-themed event. That's fine with her. But to don kilts for the purpose of going to a restaurant, she would think strange.

I'm surprised that this thread has mutated into another 'white hose' thread! Hose colour is just one of those fashion things that changes over time. In the old days hose always seemed to be patterned. By the mid-19th century, as we can see in The Highlanders Of Scotland, plain hose were being worn. Of the 56 kilted men in HOS, 11 are wearing selfcoloured hose, 5 light grey, 5 taupe (dull brown), and 1 charcoal grey, so there didn't seem to be much variety then.

Or later! While none of my early catalogues list specific colours, my Anderson catalogue from the 1950s only offers "Fawns, Lovats, and Browns". The Tartan Gift Shop catalogue from c1960 offers only Lovat Blue, Lovat Green, and Fawn.

When I started kiltwearing in the 1970s the major shops sold Lochcarron hose and these came in a limited palette, as I recall Lovat Blue, Lovat Green, Oatmeal, and Cream. For whatever reason around that time cream hose were beginning to become popular with Evening Dress. I didn't care for that then, or now. (I might have been a teenager but I got a pair of tartan hose to match my kilt!)

Then in the late 1980s the pure stark white hose blew into the Pipe Band world. Suddenly cream hose were practically banned... I still remember seeing every single band in Grade One wearing stark white save for one wearing cream, and that band being commented upon ("what rock did they crawl out from under?"). The stark white craze still isn't quite dead... you still see a few bands wearing these, though the vast majority of bands have switched to black (or in a few cases, navy blue or charcoal grey).

What's next? Who can say. Maybe tartan hose will make a big comeback! Or brown!

[MacRobert's Reply]

I am getting married one day in my Davidson tartan kilt and was wondering what type of doublet or jacket to use , as it is a late afternoon early evening wedding followed by an evening reception at the moment its quite a distance in the future , I would like to stay as close to tradition as possible , but don't want to do what everyone else does which is black bow tie and 3 button waistcoat with the pc , however a montrose is out due to the fact the wedding will be in october and in South Africa in October its heading for summer and of course my band doublet is not suitable at all . Any suggestions ?

If the wedding is before 6pm Sean, I would go with McMurdo's recommendation. Black Argyll with silver buttons if you want the kilted equivalent of morning dress, and tweed if you want the kilted equivalent of a lounge or business suit.

If the wedding is after 6pm then all the evening jackets and doublets become options - especially as you are the bridegroom! Sheriffmuir, Regulation, Kenmore, Balmoral etc are all possibilities. Some can be worn with a bow tie, others with a lace jabot or highland cravat.

Have a look at some pictures of these jackets and doublets and see what grabs you.

[LPF]

Love the sporran

[Flavia]

You are a good son!

[Farmer Jones]

Love the sporran

you would. So do I. My kilt maker in Kingston loves it too. It is almost as if it were made to go with the Maple Leaf.