The end of traditional tartan - a personal view

[figheadair]

I'd love to hear a description of this process as well, as I had never heard before now that there was "glue" involved.

For posterity's sake, though, it's pretty easy to identify a tuck selvedge. You can see where the raw yarn ends are woven or 'tucked' back through the edge of the cloth, and appear as a fuzzy line about 1/2" or so from the edge. The twill pattern in this area is also more dense, because there are more threads than usual being crammed into this area. See the photo below (this is Lochcarron cloth on one of my kilts). Notice the fuzziness of the yarn ends just below the bottom black stripe.

The feel of the cloth is different in this area, too. It feels flatter and tighter. I would imagine that this is due mostly to the fact that the thread count is more dense here, but if there really is glue involved, that would also explain it. I'm curious what they use for this. It's definitely not a kind of glue that you can see or feel. Maybe something more like a starch?

The term 'glued' is mine and there may be some other method of securing the fold but I'm not sure starch and pressing would suffice. Quite how it's secured is somewhat secondary. I don't care what the trade propaganda says. it's not a selvedge and the finish is inferio in look and feel.

One of the things that this technique removes is the ability (for aesthetic reasons) to finish the edge in the middle of a large block of colour. Take a look at any tuck hem (it's not a selvedge ) and you'll see that it always finishes hard against a line of a difference colour so as to hide, as much as possible, the difference in the quality of the cloth at that point. The heavier the cloth the worse the effect.

[sydnie7]

I'd love to hear a description of this process as well, as I had never heard before now that there was "glue" involved.

For posterity's sake, though, it's pretty easy to identify a tuck selvedge. You can see where the raw yarn ends are woven or 'tucked' back through the edge of the cloth, and appear as a fuzzy line about 1/2" or so from the edge. The twill pattern in this area is also more dense, because there are more threads than usual being crammed into this area. See the photo below (this is Lochcarron cloth on one of my kilts). Notice the fuzziness of the yarn ends just below the bottom black stripe.

The feel of the cloth is different in this area, too. It feels flatter and tighter. I would imagine that this is due mostly to the fact that the thread count is more dense here, but if there really is glue involved, that would also explain it. I'm curious what they use for this. It's definitely not a kind of glue that you can see or feel. Maybe something more like a starch?

Great photo. But doesn't the tuck only show on one side of the fabric, so that your kilt could have been made with that fuzzy line inside? [OT] I can't figure out what that would have done to the direction of the twill line (too many "now imagine this turned round" for my head right now) and other discussions have offered that twill line direction can vary based on the fabric anyway. . . so moot, but I wanted to put it on record anyway. [/OT]

[jhockin]

Just found this, after much searching:

12/12/13--06:17: Bosses silent on Dalgliesh jobs axing (chan 1908631)
UP TO eight jobs are expected to be axed at the local tartan weaving company of D.C. Dalgliesh, writes Bob Burgess.

But repeated attempts during the course of this week to obtain confirmation from Edinburgh-based bosses have failed.

They failed to respond to email and phone requests. An email send to Dalgliesh’s Dunsdale Mill was forwarded to the company’s partners, Scotweb, in the capital, but went unanswered.

We have tried several times to speak with appropriate directors at Scotweb without success. Scotweb founder Dr Nick Fiddes has not responded.

The Scotweb website states: “We are here for you. Please just ask if we can help in any way.”

We have been told locally that seven or eight jobs will be made redundant at D.C. Dalgliesh. A number of workers have already been informed.

The company was established in the town by Dick and Anne Dalgliesh in 1947 and in 1965 expanded and moved into the current premises.

According to the Scotweb web site, they launched in April 1995 as Scotland’s first secure e-business portal.

The site also states [In 2005]: “We began our special relationship with D.C. Dalgliesh weavers, and specialise in marketing their rare tartans, quickly establishing ourselves as their largest customer.”

It goes on [In April 2011]: “D.C. Dalgliesh weaving mill struggles in the recession and approaches us as their natural partner to rescue them from closure. We implement a development plan to save this unique part of Scottish traditions.”

And it reveals [In September 2011]: “Now united with D.C. Dalgliesh as the world’s leading resource for tartan fabrics and goods, we rename our retail business Tartan Mill, as Scotweb becomes the parent company.”

[jhockin]

And this:

Jobs axed at Selkirk mill - The Southern Reporter
http://www.thesouthernreporter.co.uk...k-mill-1-32484...
Dec 28, 2013 - TARTAN specialists DC Dalgliesh are shedding six jobs at their Dunsdale Mill in Selkirk, ... business to be a long-term success story for Selkirk and Scotland.”

So far, nothing more recent, but sounds ominous

[artificer]

I've got to say that I don't particularly like the sound of this news from Dalgliesh.

It would be a pity to lose such an important resource, even if they were downright rude the last time we went to commission a run of the R'lyeh sett (we ended up using Marton Mills instead).

ith:

[Father Bill]

Not something I understand well, but it certainly feels ominous.

[tundramanq]

Hmm, interesting - I checked my kilts - all but two are tuck selvedged. The exceptions are Jerry's Stillwater wool kilts. I looked in my info file - they are advertised as having "traditional selvedges". It appears some shuttle looms do exist outside the isles.

[unixken]

And this:

Jobs axed at Selkirk mill - The Southern Reporter
http://www.thesouthernreporter.co.uk...k-mill-1-32484...
Dec 28, 2013 - TARTAN specialists DC Dalgliesh are shedding six jobs at their Dunsdale Mill in Selkirk, ... business to be a long-term success story for Selkirk and Scotland.”

So far, nothing more recent, but sounds ominous

The link in the quoted post didn't work for me, but here's another that does:
http://www.thesouthernreporter.co.uk...mill-1-3248480

This was published just before New Year.

[figheadair]

Great photo. But doesn't the tuck only show on one side of the fabric, so that your kilt could have been made with that fuzzy line inside? [OT] I can't figure out what that would have done to the direction of the twill line (too many "now imagine this turned round" for my head right now) and other discussions have offered that twill line direction can vary based on the fabric anyway. . . so moot, but I wanted to put it on record anyway. [/OT]

You're absolutely right. The one was in effect made inside-out. Another reason to have a proper selvedge which means that there is no right side to the cloth. Having said that, commercial cloth is finished (rolled) on one side so even material with a true selevedge often comes with a note saying 'good face' or the like. No such problem with handwoven cloth though.

[Calgacus]

I have a swatch of Lochcarron Strome in front of me that happens to have a tuck selvedge along one edge. I unravelled a few threads to take a look at its construction. There appears to be no glue, the weft simply loops round the last warp thread then is woven back into the cloth for about 20 threads. Something clever happens when the 'outgoing' thread loops round the last warp thread because the 'returning' thread follows the weave of the outgoing one and is not on the 'opposite weave', if you see what I mean. If I can find a magnifying glass I could probably determine exactly how it's done.

The whole structure is held together simply by friction. If you snagged one of the edge threads and pulled hard enough I suspect the end would pull out, if the thread didn't break first. The selvedge area is denser than the rest of the cloth, having 50% extra wool per square inch.

The selvedge is visible from both sides, though there is a good side and a bad side, the threads having been cut off leaving a slightly fuzzy line on the bad side. The selvedge is disguised by ending at the transition between colours.