Two Telling comments? The Answer Perhaps?

[McMurdo]

Perhaps the name of the forum needs to change to XMarkstheAmericanTourist. While I completely understand where you are coming from Jock and I do appreciate your bringing this up I wonder where exactly the tartan industry would be without the enthusiastic American Tourist? It seems to me that there is a love hate relationship with all things kilt and tartan in Scotland, on the one hand tartan and the kilt are national symbols that have resonated and become recognized the world over. On the other hand people do not want to look like a tourist in their own country or look too Scottish.

Another symptom of this type of thinking is that the kilt is to be only worn in Scotland by Scots in a certain way, Tartan Army be damned. The real problem with this exclusionary, inclusive thinking in the modern global climate is that the market will continue to shrink into non existence.

I am not a Scot, I am a Canadian, born to Scottish parents. One thing about Canada is that we are never too far away from our heritage. For example, just a few blocks away is Bannochburn Drive. A few weeks ago I was watching a news program, the news started with pipers then it went to a céilidh, after that they went over to a story on the gaelic community centre, was I watching news from Scotland? No it was news from Atlantic Canada. So you see I am living in a place that tells me that traditions are really kept alive by people not places.

I am sorry you feel the way you do and I am sorry your friend feels the way he does regarding the kilt. To my mind one way to change the mindset would be for Scots, real Scots, to wear the kilt and show the unwashed masses how to do it right.

[Cyd]

... I am sorry you feel the way you do and I am sorry your friend feels the way he does regarding the kilt. To my mind one way to change the mindset would be for Scots, real Scots, to wear the kilt and show the unwashed masses how to do it right.

So "real Scots" are Canadians??

I share your opinions on an "exclusionary mindset" but with all respect, aren't you guilty of the very same thing by first lumping those who see the kilt as a garment reserved for special occasions as being of such a mindset, then suggesting that those same people are not "real Scots" because they don't see tradition through your eyes from a few thousand miles away?

I would suggest that if you are going to argue that opinions from members of the forum from Scotland should be discounted because their view of Highland dress is more conservative than yours and Canadians can somehow "do it better," you damage your own reputation not those you attack. Your last sentence almost gave me whiplash. JockScot was trying to educate. The whole point is that "real Scots" as a group do not, and have never, worn kilts as daily wear! The notion that in promoting that you are somehow reviving a tradition or heritage is absolutely ridiculous.

I have no problem with this as a forum or you individually promoting regularly wearing a kilt. There are even good arguments for doing so. Let's try to keep it real however. To do so is to change tradition, not revive it.

To the moderators: Do you ever moderate yourselves? McMurdo's comments about "real Scots" are quite offensive to REAL Scots, not to mention the "unwashed masses" (assuming they are not synonymous with people born in Scotland that don't wear a kilt)!

[Cyd]

Perhaps the name of the forum needs to change to XMarkstheAmericanTourist. While I completely understand where you are coming from Jock and I do appreciate your bringing this up I wonder where exactly the tartan industry would be without the enthusiastic American Tourist? It seems to me that there is a love hate relationship with all things kilt and tartan in Scotland, on the one hand tartan and the kilt are national symbols that have resonated and become recognized the world over. On the other hand people do not want to look like a tourist in their own country or look too Scottish.

Another symptom of this type of thinking is that the kilt is to be only worn in Scotland by Scots in a certain way, Tartan Army be damned. The real problem with this exclusionary, inclusive thinking in the modern global climate is that the market will continue to shrink into non existence.

I am not a Scot, I am a Canadian, born to Scottish parents. One thing about Canada is that we are never too far away from our heritage. For example, just a few blocks away is Bannochburn Drive. A few weeks ago I was watching a news program, the news started with pipers then it went to a céilidh, after that they went over to a story on the gaelic community centre, was I watching news from Scotland? No it was news from Atlantic Canada. So you see I am living in a place that tells me that traditions are really kept alive by people not places.

I am sorry you feel the way you do and I am sorry your friend feels the way he does regarding the kilt. To my mind one way to change the mindset would be for Scots, real Scots, to wear the kilt and show the unwashed masses how to do it right.

McMurdo, I think this has pretty much worn itself out, but I will accept for the sake of discussion that I have completely misinterpreted your comments.

So everyone knows what we are talking about, I have quoted your post in its entirety. As you claim I have taken you out of context, perhaps you would be kind enough to explain to me and everyone else who exactly you were referring to as "real Scots" and "the unwashed masses." On their face those certainly seem to be derogatory references.

[ThistleDown]

Cyd et al, we'll just drop this aspect of the discussion, shall we? Move along, move along. This is now the second warning shot in an otherwise instructive thread.

[McMurdo]

Cyd
I originally posted on July 13 of last year, to date you are the only person to question my post or what I meant. I therefore see no need to explain that which was clear in the first place.

[Cyd]

Cyd
I originally posted on July 13 of last year, to date you are the only person to question my post or what I meant. I therefore see no need to explain that which was clear in the first place.

You have a need because you have accused me of getting it wrong by "quoting you out of context." It makes no difference how old your comments are. Time does not make them any less offensive. Now you have context. Where is the problem with the interpretation.

I have given you an opportunity to clarify and as you can't seem to explain yourself or how I am wrong in my interpretation, there is no reason to believe my original comments are not correct. Your claims to being "quoted out of context" are nothing more than an attempt to deflect attention away from your actual remarks.

Just explain were the error is or have the integrity to admit you misspoke.

[ThistleDown]

Another flag has been dropped. This thread is moving to the Cooling Off corner while the Moderators meet to discuss. Such a shame.

[cessna152towser]

Thread returned to original location and re-opened for posting now that the flags have been resolved.