X Marks the Scot - An on-line community of kilt wearers.

   X Marks Partners - (Go to the Partners Dedicated Forums )
USA Kilts website Celtic Croft website Celtic Corner website Houston Kiltmakers

User Tag List

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 11 to 13 of 13
  1. #11
    Join Date
    18th October 09
    Location
    Orange County California
    Posts
    11,151
    Mentioned
    18 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I learned a long time ago to post photos and let them do most of the talking. Whenever I just said anything, people would post that I was just making it all up! Off-putting, when I had a hundred photos in front of me showing exactly what I was saying. I came to realise that the people doing the criticising didn't have those photos sitting in front of them!

    Likewise with The Highlanders Of Scotland. If I post an image from that, 20 people will say that MacLeay was inventing everything. So I post a photograph taken the same time showing precisely the same thing, which people accept. A perpetual head-scratcher, that.

    Anyhow the story that the Glengarry was devised by an officer of The Cameron Highlanders in the 1840s seems to be rubbish. There are a number of portraits showing it earlier, and showing it worn by civilians. The accepted story seems to be that the Glengarry was first worn by The Glengarry Fencibles in the late 18th century.

    Here's an early Glengarry, which appears to be merely a folded bonnet, in 1822



    Here's one of the earliest photos I've seen of the Glengarry, showing the same thing as the painting above.



    This bonnet is oddly shaped



    This one has a more 'modern' shape to it, though in the first half of the 19th century



    Now, about the Glengarry Fencibles, raised in 1794, here is their commander in 1812 (several years after the unit was disbanded). This bonnet has an intricate border I've not seen elsewhere. Is it the first "Glengarry" bonnet?

    Last edited by OC Richard; 7th February 15 at 06:35 AM.
    Proud Mountaineer from the Highlands of West Virginia; son of the Revolution and Civil War; first Europeans on the Guyandotte

  2. #12
    Join Date
    7th February 11
    Location
    London, Canada
    Posts
    9,557
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Thanks Richard. I imagine that many have come to understand your status as an expert based on your incredible photo collection. However did you become interested in collecting them?

    Sorry for the hijack on the thread.
    Rev'd Father Bill White: Mostly retired Parish Priest & former Elementary Headmaster. Lover of God, dogs, most people, joy, tradition, humour & clarity. Legion Padre, theologian, teacher, philosopher, linguist, encourager of hearts & souls & a firm believer in dignity, decency, & duty. A proud Canadian Sinclair with solid Welsh and other heritage.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    20th August 11
    Posts
    44
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by OC Richard View Post
    Anyhow the story that the Glengarry was devised by an officer of The Cameron Highlanders in the 1840s seems to be rubbish. There are a number of portraits showing it earlier, and showing it worn by civilians. The accepted story seems to be that the Glengarry was first worn by The Glengarry Fencibles in the late 18th century.
    I think the association of the Glengarry with the 79th has to do specifically with a pleated bonnet, constructed so that it could fold flat neatly and be stowed away by soldiers, unlike the round undress bonnet which had assumed impractical proportions if we are to judge by the photos of the 92nd taken at Edinburgh Castle in 1845.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Sgt 92nd c.1845.jpg 
Views:	6 
Size:	18.6 KB 
ID:	24086

    As your selection shows, Richard, the soft bonnet with a fore-and-aft crease was being worn some time earlier, from at least c.1820 onwards, according to surviving images.

    It's interesting that Logan in Costumes of the Clans of Scotland should have said:
    "The form of bonnet, which has received the name of a “Glengarry,” is not of more than about fourty years' standing" - (which would mean around 1805) adding- "and in the opinion of many it is in no way an improvement on the original shape."

    We probably shouldn't place too much reliance on a date reached by that route but, at any rate, the illustration by McIan shows a soft crowned bonnet similar to the bonnets we see from about 1820 onwards, so we know what they meant by a Glengarry in 1845.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Mac Donnel c.1845.jpg 
Views:	6 
Size:	20.7 KB 
ID:	24087

    It's a moot point whether Macdonnell of Glengarry introduced the 'Glengarry' bonnet for his Fencibles circa 1794. I'm not sure we have any evidence as to the style of the bonnet they wore but I imagine we would first need to distinguish between a 'mounted' uniform bonnet and some sort of undress headgear.

    If you look closely at the bonnet shown in the Raeburn portrait, it's not actually pleated or even creased but is simply a slightly shaped version of the cylindrical, cocked bonnet worn by Highland regiments since the 1770s. A boat-shaped style of bonnet, with a pronounced 'prow' known sometimes as the 'cockit bonnet' <http://www.dsl.ac.uk/entry/snd/cockit_bonnet> - can be seen being worn by a number of soldiers and civilians in John Kay's caricatures of Edinburgh personages from the 1780s and 1790s.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Hugh Montgomerie, Earl of Eglinton (Kay).jpg 
Views:	5 
Size:	36.4 KB 
ID:	24088
    Macdonnell's bonnet looks as if it has been blocked into a fairly rigid shape. He is not in military uniform but in any case it is doubtful that gentlemen of his standing would have been a-folding up their best bonnets and tucking them in a knapsack.

    It's possible that the softer bonnet with a creased crown depicted by McIan as referred to by Logan came to be associated with the publicity-seeking chieftain following his antics during the visit of King George IV to Edinburgh in 1822. I see that the Dictionary of the Scots language supports that notion- although they also reference the Raeburn portrait. Whether their note is based on more concrete evidence, I couldn't say. <http://www.dsl.ac.uk/entry/snd/glengarry>

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	file-1.jpg 
Views:	5 
Size:	53.1 KB 
ID:	24085
    Last edited by jf42; 7th February 15 at 06:50 PM.

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

» Log in

User Name:

Password:

Not a member yet?
Register Now!
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v4.2.0