Matching Flashes and necktie with Tartan? Poor form?

[Mike S]

I agree it looks wonderful. But I wouldn't call that " too matchy-matchy" by my definition either, Liam.

[Spartan Tartan]

I agree with the previous posts about wearing the tie with a suit or slacks, but not necessarily with a kilt.

Matching tartan flashes on the other hand are a LONG way from "matchy matchy" look. If you like the look, then go for it. If you wear the flashes with just about an inch exposed there will certainly not be an overwhelming amount of tartan to distract from the kilt.

Having said that, my personal style and preference is to wear garter ties, not flashes. I think they are more comfortable and I prefer the look for myself. Although tartan flashes are not something I would wear, I don't think it's generally considered "poor form". In fact, my experience is that outside this forum (most kilted people I actually see are NOT members here) it is more common to have matching flashes than not.

[OC Richard]

Get just matching tartan flashes?
Get matching tartan necktie?
Get both matching tartan flashes and necktie?
Get none of the above becuase it is poor form?

Well first and foremost congratulations on that kilt. Weathered Gordon is gorgeous.

I'm not the average kiltwearer, I suppose, because for 40 years I've studied old paintings and photographs and have quite a collection of vintage Highland Dress photos.

So my "eye" is steeped in the past, one could say, and I tend to take the long view of things. I also am interested in the origins and original functions and methods of construction of things, which often colours my view.

The thing about flashes cut and sewn out of woven fabric yardage (whether tartan or not) is that 1) they're quite recent and 2) they fly in the face of the traditional methods of construction and materials.

Flashes are merely the ends of the garters, and garters were always made out of stuff especially woven to the correct width for that purpose. They could be wool or silk or what have you, but the point is that they were woven to purpose. I don't know about the old days, but at least from the 19th century to today they're generally woven from worsted wool in a herringbone pattern. The vast majority of garters in the old days were scarlet. They're usually selfcoloured/plain/solid but sometimes striped. Tartan is rare, but if so they would be tartan ribbon woven to the correct width for that purpose.

Ditto the drone ribbons on the bagpipes: traditionally they were silk ribbon woven to the correct width especially for that purpose; nowadays they're often cut and sewn from woven tartan yardage, which to my eye looks crude and untraditional.

About tartan neckties those, it seems to me, have always been rare with Highland Dress. Worn, but rarely so. In the old days neckwear was nearly always black or white so any colour was rare. In modern 20th century Highland Day Dress the favoured neckties have been regimental stripe or all-over pattern or selfcoloured/plain/solid.

So myself I would forgo the tartan yardage flashes but get the necktie- to wear with Saxon dress.

[McMurdo]

I think it all together screams matchy and I just bought this entire package. It is almost as over the top as wearing a Prince Charlie to a Highland Games. I would suggest looking at the 1 kilt 10 looks thread:
http://www.xmarksthescot.com/forum/f...-attire-46888/

Jamie and I do not wear tartan ties at all there rather we both generally wear ties that are one of the colours out of our kilts a solid red or green on my part. This works well as it does not take away from the tartan rather it coordinates well. Of course if you have a school or regimental tie wearing that is preferable.

[Stan]

Hello my fellow Kilt Brethren -
I just ordered my first 13 oz weathered Gordon kilt from USA Kilts out of Pennsylvania (advertised on this board heard great things about them). I understand that the majority of this question is a matter of personal taste; however I wanted to seek out the communities opinion.
Get just matching tartan flashes?
Get matching tartan necktie?
Get both matching tartan flashes and necktie?
Get none of the above becuase it is poor form?
Please feel free to give me your opinion, I am thick skinned. LOL

Personally I like that look, and have a tartan tie for each tartan that I own... At first, (on occasion) I wandered if tie, kilt, and flashes were a bit to much, but when complemented on the look by my fellow pipe band members, and others (members of the Scots club, AND strangers) I think that that "3 way" match is not only fine, but pretty snappy... I like to wear my "three some" with a black (or charcoal grey) 5 button waist coat.

I say go for it... I think that you'll like it.

[OC Richard]

Here, for example, are four Scottish gents who have been wearing Highland Dress their entire lives, pretty much.

You can see the sorts of neckties and flashes they favour.



In Britain, by the way, your necktie often says something about you: your university, your regiment, your club, or what have you.

When I was a member of the RSCDS I wore that tie.

Here are some of the ties I wear nowadays. The Irish one on the far right is my St Patrick's Day tie. There are a couple ties from a Pipe Band I used to be in, one that represents my home state, one the football club I support, and the RSCDS. The red striped tie, which belonged to my late father-in-law, is based on the WWII Victory ribbon. I wear it to honour him, my uncle, and my stepfather, all WWII veterans who are no longer with us.



Due to Highland Dress' home being in Britain, I prefer the look, with Highland Dress, of ties striped in the British manner, "from the heart" as they say.

Anyhow is showing up in Highland Dress with matching kilt, tie, and flashes "poor form"? That may be going a bit far, but it's one of those things that usually "just isn't done".

[Jock Scot]

For what it is worth most old school kilt wearers do not wear tartan garters, or self tie garter ties of any form. However some---a few--- of the old school do wear tartan neck ties on occasion when wearing the kilt. Yes I think most old school Scottish kilt wearers would say that tartan worn around the hose, is one of those things that is just not done and rather new fangled. Most would think that several yards of tartan in the form of the kilt is more than enough.

[OC Richard]

Most would think that several yards of tartan in the form of the kilt is more than enough.

Indeed!

In the piping world (which is has always been my primary point of contact with Highland Dress) I think it's one of those action > equal and opposite reaction things.

For so long- since the early 19th century at least- the typical piper's kit was like this, overflowing with endless yards of tartan, tartan on kilt, plaid, bag-cover, drone ribbons, and hose



When I started piping in the mid-1970s pipe bands were still wearing this kit in competition! It WAS the piper's kit. (The other popular kit was full Evening Dress with tartan hose and belted plaid, plenty of tartan there too.)

A Highland Games in the 1960s. Tartan hose for all. Everyone in military-style Full Dress or civilian Evening Dress. No ghillies, Argyll jackets, or ghillies are to be seen.



Then a sea-change happened in the piping world and there was a quick move in as opposite a direction as possible. The new piper's kit emphasized sharp simplicity, and the greatest possible reduction in the amount of tartan, the kilt alone. The new kit, for better or for worse, was the black Argyll jacket, shirt & tie, white hose (!), ghillie brogues, black leather hunting sporran, and a Glengarry.



There was a thing which held sway for at least a decade where everything in the kit except the kilt was either white or black. Tartan stuff? No way. A band would get looks, not good ones, if it showed up with tartan bag-covers, for example.

Either back in the day of Full Dress, or elaborate Evening Dress, or the modern pipe band dress, tartan flashes and ties weren't part of it.

[JP Gordon]

I think it all together screams matchy and I just bought this entire package. It is almost as over the top as wearing a Prince Charlie to a Highland Games. I would suggest looking at the 1 kilt 10 looks thread:
http://www.xmarksthescot.com/forum/f...-attire-46888/

Jamie and I do not wear tartan ties at all there rather we both generally wear ties that are one of the colours out of our kilts a solid red or green on my part. This works well as it does not take away from the tartan rather it coordinates well. Of course if you have a school or regimental tie wearing that is preferable.

Thank you for the advice.

[JP Gordon]

Here, for example, are four Scottish gents who have been wearing Highland Dress their entire lives, pretty much.

You can see the sorts of neckties and flashes they favour.



In Britain, by the way, your necktie often says something about you: your university, your regiment, your club, or what have you.

When I was a member of the RSCDS I wore that tie.

Here are some of the ties I wear nowadays. The Irish one on the far right is my St Patrick's Day tie. There are a couple ties from a Pipe Band I used to be in, one that represents my home state, one the football club I support, and the RSCDS. The red striped tie, which belonged to my late father-in-law, is based on the WWII Victory ribbon. I wear it to honour him, my uncle, and my stepfather, all WWII veterans who are no longer with us.



Due to Highland Dress' home being in Britain, I prefer the look, with Highland Dress, of ties striped in the British manner, "from the heart" as they say.

Anyhow is showing up in Highland Dress with matching kilt, tie, and flashes "poor form"? That may be going a bit far, but it's one of those things that usually "just isn't done".

Thank you for the advice and the photos, this helps a lot.