Kilts in the office

[davedove]

I don't want to look for a fight (not with you, with potential employers) with this but I have apretty good chance of getting a parts running part time job while I am in college (I will be starting classes to 26th, 4 days). Basicly it will be driving a truck around picking up parts from various vendors and delivering them back to the shop. It is a small plumbing business and all I would be doing is interacting with the owner, the business' parts vendors and a truck that I may be driving up to (probably a rare occurance) 200 miles in one day.

My question is how would I approch wearing a kilt in this environment? There is no memo system, no human resources department, just a guy and his 7(?) employees who he does not want to pay ~$30 an hour to sit in front of a parts vendor in a truck.

I assume since it's a small business, you probably won't have a set uniform to wear. If you do, we can't help you. But, if there's no uniform, you shouldn't have a problem. I can't imagine there is any safety issue either, so that's not a concern. As long as you dress respectfully and represent the employer well, kilt or trousers, dress as you like.

[Alan H]

KCW, Archangel DOES have a point. I mean, once you get acceptance from your boss, and possibly HIS boss, or someone else with some authority, then there comes a point where you just DO it.

As the old saying goes, it's easier to beg forgiveness than ask permission.

Let's say you clear it with someone else in the company "chain". If that's your contactperson in HR, then cool. Then you just wear your kilt. You will, of course, be sure to wear it in an entirely professional manner. If you work in a financial institution and suits and ties are the accepted norm, then you'll need to drop some cash on a real, and I mean REAL kilt jacket and possibly a waistcoat to go underneath it.. No "budget fakes" by altering a sportscoat, get a real jacket.

Think on it. How many suits or sportcoat/slacks combinations do you have for work? I bet you have at least 4-5. You'll need 4-5 kilt/jacket combinations, too if you're going to do this full-time. That's some serious cash. Start out with one and see how it goes and if you like it.

Bu yeah, be courteous, be smart, document everything with memos and e-mail, but don't go LOOKING for trouble. I'd say once you have your bosses OK and the OK of one person in HR, then document their acceptance in an e-mail or a memo and then just GO for it. At that it's up to someone inthe company or in HR to file a complaintand then have the HR department chase it down. That's a LOT different from asking ten different people in positions of authority, because if you do that, you'll be sure to find at least one who won't like it,and then you're hosed.

[Alan H]

BTW KCW,do NOT wear a standard mens sportscoat to work where you must present a professional and more formal appearance. They don't work, they're cut too long,the lines just don't work. Start watching ebay, or shop the Kilt Store link at the top of the page for a real kilt jacket, probably one without shiny buttons, and grit your teeth and spend the money.

[auld argonian]

For myself, it's difficult to deal with ordering a jacket without being able to try it on. It's usually the way the shoulders fit...and one manufacturer's 42 regular isn't the same as another's. I understand that stuff can be sent back...but that can be difficult just within the continental US, let alone overseas. There's the possibility of getting a tailor to alter things but my experience with a lot of them is that they do not want to mess with the shoulders of a jacket...somehow that's really difficult, even when you ask them to take some of the padding out of them to avoid that "Clark Kent" look where the shoulders of the jacket look exagerated. And it's easy to say, "Find another tailor," but I have to tell you that this has been my experience with just about every one that I've spoken to...who wants to make finding a tailor a full-time job?

Do any of the "Hong Kong" tailors operate like they used to twenty odd years ago...they guy that my family used would send out postcards ahead of time and announce when he'd be in town and where he'd be staying (usually for several days). You'd make an apointment, show up, get measured and look at fabrics and order your stuff. A couple of months later it would show up in the post and it was usually top-notch. Perhaps somebody should try to work something like that out: send a representative on a tour of the US with samples and a tape measure and take orders.

Like a lot of people, I don't mind spending money on something that's worth it...I just don't want to get into a situation where I'm going back and forth and searching for alterations. I haven't got the time or the patience.

best

Auld Argonian

[KiltedCodeWarrior]

KCW, Archangel DOES have a point. I mean, once you get acceptance from your boss, and possibly HIS boss, or someone else with some authority, then there comes a point where you just DO it.

As the old saying goes, it's easier to beg forgiveness than ask permission....

Alan, I definitely agree Archangel has a point, see my earlier (but delayed due to work!) post. If I continue to ask for permission, then I will find somebody closed minded who won't say yes, no matter what.

On your other point regarding the formality of the kilt and accessories, I totally agree. Luckily I work in a business casual environment. Currently I would wear khaki slacks or other equivalent trousers, and a pullover, collared shirt with semi-dress shoes. My plan was to wear my Stillwater standard Nightstalker kile with black hose and flashes, black dress shoes, and a button down oxford shirt. I think that this would actually be slightly more formal than my current attire. After a few weeks, I would consider going a little less formal and introduce a sportkilt with the same accessories.

Any feedback on what I am proposing to wear and how formal/informal it is in regards to what I wear today would be appreciated.

RJI

[KiltedCodeWarrior]

Does posting 6 in a row on your own thread indicate hijacking the thread or talking to yourself?

RJI

[Southern Breeze]

Does posting 6 in a row on your own thread indicate hijacking the thread or talking to yourself?

RJI

Nope,you're just getting in touch with your inner politician. :-D

[Archangel]

I think I'm beginning to see what you're after. You're a senior employee and are expected to set an example to the juniors. I've been hit with that too. It surprised me that I had gained that much seniority. It surprised management that I was not that impressed and not willing to take on the responsibility of being a good example.

Here's what I see. You really want to do this and do it as perfect as can be. Realize that perfection is not attainable. Close will have to do. You're also trying to determine the kilted equivalent of the business uniform. I'm not sure it translates well but your best bet would be to wander around 21stCentury's site: http://www.21stcenturykilts.co.uk/discountedpackage.htm. The kilt doesn't translate well. I prefer to think of it the other way around. The business suit is wrong. Anyway, if you are trying to find the right jacket to complete the look, I would suggest you give up, for now.

My personal rule is when in doubt, try and look military. I would suggest khaki colour shirts with military type pockets, Eddie Bauer usually has this style. Hamish would suggest socks to match. In an office I would suggest the thinner socks rather than the thick wool ones, heavier shoes rather than boots. A thin black tie would complete the look, a tie with a small clan crest would help keep the focus. These aren't any rules, they're just what I'd try to do.

Anyway, at some point you're going to have to jump out the plane.
Here's the samurai philosophy, which works well in this kind of case: prepare to die. This means as you approach the situation what is the worst that can happen? Can you accept that? If yes, go: if no, stop.

My feeling is that you would be okay. You're a senior employee, you've got some kind of permission, there is a HR department. You might get called in to discuss this. You've already got lots of advice from here so you know the parameters, make them chase you, give them short, one word answers. Worst case scenario, they tell you not to do it again. That starts you off on another campaign. Each step has a specific response.

Do you have casual Fridays, United Way Fridays, gosh, why not? That would be the best way for you to test the water.
Or dive right into the deep end Monday morning.
Either way, you'll just add to your legend.

Best wishes.

[yoippari]

I FIANLLY got in contact with my pontential employer. I have called him multiple times over the past couple of weeks and left two voicemails. I talked to his father in law (a friend that temporarally employed me recently) and he said that his bad phone habits is just the way he is. So I called him on a saturday instead of a weekday. Apparently he deleted the voicemails before writing down my number (though all cellphones have caller id now). It payed off and now I will be meeting him after school on monday. I plan on wearing my stillwater that day (I have worn it to the school in the past two weeks 4 out of the 5 times I have been there) so we can discuss the kilt before wearing it on the job, that is if he wants to discuss it at all, he might just ignore or overlook it.

If need be I will bring up the "standing out when waiting for a part can be usefull" aspect of the kilt, but as you guys have said, I will let him find something wrong before I try to "sell" him on it.

[Prester John]

I'd still like to start a company where the dress code, officially, was tartan kilts for men, kilted skirts for ladies.

Hey, you know it would get press!