X Marks Tents at Gatherings

[macwilkin]

Let me play devil's advocate here and ask: what exactly will you be doing at the games, besides promoting Xmarks? I believe this question was raised before in another thread when someone brought this idea up -- which kiltmakers will you be promoting, and will the vendors at the games like that? I know at some games I have attended, the clan tents have to be very careful in what they sell because the vendors don't want competition -- I'm not saying I agree with that, but it's still something to consider.

Also, many games & festivals charge registration fees, rentals, etc. -- who will pay for that. Again, something to discuss before the tent ever goes up.

And, in regards to tartan identification, you may be in someone else's "bailiwick", such as the Council of Scottish Clans and Associations (COSCA), the Scottish District Families Association (SDFA), the Tartan Educational & Cultural Association (TECA), etc. These organisations will sometimes provide information tents for clan/tartan look-ups, etc.

Not trying to "rain on anyone's parade", but just giving food for thought before anyone spends any major amounts of money.

Cheers,

Todd

[auld argonian]

Todd's comments are very near to my own point of view about Xmarks...it exist as a sort of kilt-advocacy group and care has to be taken to keep it sort of "neutral" in the kilt hierarchy. It would be unfair to advocate or to even seem to advocate one style of kilt or any particular kiltmakers...the idea is to promote the everyday wearing of the kilt in situations, as it says, other than highland games or celtic fests or whatever. As much fun as it is to spread the word about Xmarks and kiltwearing it's obvious that one would have to tread lightly and respect some of the other organizations' "turf".

I always favor the "soft sell" approach. Buttons or bumper stickers that get them to ask or to look up the URL. I think that you'd be preaching to the choir at highland games...if there's anyone there who DOESN'T own a kilt when they arrive, they'll be seriously thinking about getting one by the time they leave...not to mention the opportunity to make arrangements with one of the vendors present to either buy a ready made on the spot or place an order. The trick is to get those marginally interested or those who aren't quite sure that they can carry it off to come to this forum and get some info and support....not to mention that you guys are some of the funniest and most literate people posting on the web. That's what Xmarks does well...act as a support group.

Best

AA

[switchblade5984]

we dont advertise kilts its a registered Irish Clan Booth

the only thing we do is help people to find where their familys were/could have been located

we sell clan tshirts and cap badges

[macwilkin]

we dont advertise kilts its a registered Irish Clan Booth

the only thing we do is help people to find where their familys were/could have been located

we sell clan tshirts and cap badges

Like most other Scottish/Irish clan/family associations, including my own -- I was referring to a possible Xmarks tent, not the Clan Cian tent. See my most recent post.

T.

[michael steinrok]

Geez you guys lighten up! The idea of the tent was two fold. A place to hang out and aplace to promote daily kilt wearing. Cost for tent space is cheap and usually covers admission for several people. Wasn't planning on selling stuff Just having a good time. My chieftain offered space, any way. The costs would be absorbed by myself or any other of the local California X'ers.

Take a major chill pill! Some of us like the idea, but we don't want to get in trouble either. Mostly we would promote the forum. A lot of the guys around here are very friendly and it would serve as a meeting place as well when attending games.

I didn't wish to stir up controversy.

[The Wizard of BC]

There is, and always will be, a prominant X Marks poster in my tent whenever I go to an event.
People can ask about it if they wish. I sometimes refer people with questions here to get the brutal truth.
No selling of X Marks stuff, just a referance to information if they want it.

Not once has an X Marks member mentioned the poster and introduced themselves. Heck, it's a small poster. But one day, one day, about 50 of you will find yourselves clustered around all at once, and what a party that will turn out to be.

[motorman4life]

Michael is right. I think the idea would be well received and no one is trying to steal business from anyone else... at least no more than goes on here already. It is not like that is even close to being out of control here and I just don't see it as an issue with our members.

It is worth considering that many of the guys wearing kilts at the various Highland Games and Clan festivals only wear their kilt once or twice a year. I was one of those guys for about 5 years. I had a $300 kilt from Geofrey Tailor that I honestly had never considered wearing out-and-about on a regular, everyday basis. That is until I started seeing Utilikilts being worn with some frequency. Once I ordered my UK, the jonesing began and only then did it dawn on me that I didn't need to "suffer" and that I had a perfectly good kilt in my closet! D'oh! That first kilted trip to Starbucks resulted in the birth of www.KiltDay.com... about 3 weeks before my first UK arrived!

As we all know, Xmarks is a great social group. There is a wealth of great information, resources and a wide array of supportive people who all pretty much agree kilts are not a fad, but a viable option for everyday male attire. Whether you are celebrating your Scotish heritage, your Celtic roots, your Northern European/American/Welsh/Irish/Aussie/Canadian/UK pride or just want to be comfortable!

Giving our members a central rally point at these events while offering an opportunity to meet others and share our ideas and maybe even intorduce a great "target audience" to the concept of wearing their kilt outside "the games" and inviting them to participate in this worthwhile forum, is something I would certainly be proud to be a part of.

Count me in!

[macwilkin]

Geez you guys lighten up! The idea of the tent was two fold. A place to hang out and aplace to promote daily kilt wearing. Cost for tent space is cheap and usually covers admission for several people. Wasn't planning on selling stuff Just having a good time. My chieftain offered space, any way. The costs would be absorbed by myself or any other of the local California X'ers.

Take a major chill pill! Some of us like the idea, but we don't want to get in trouble either. Mostly we would promote the forum. A lot of the guys around here are very friendly and it would serve as a meeting place as well when attending games.

I didn't wish to stir up controversy.

Devil's Advocate: someone who takes the worse side just for the sake of argument.

See also constructive criticism.

Michael, Mark, et al:

I'm sorry if I offended you (I can't speak for AA) with my thoughts on the idea. I can assure you that none were meant to be mean-spirited or malicious -- I just wanted to provide you (and others) with "food for thought" before you took on a project like this. And if you would have read my post carefully, I never said that 1). you were planning to sell anything, just that vendors/organisers might not understand your purpose, especially if you were on clan row and 2). The idea of using your clan's tent as a "base of operations" probably was a better one.

I've been going to games/festivals/reenactments for over a decade now, so I just wanted to throw in my "two bobs" on what I have learned, good and bad, as a spectator, participant and organiser -- clan coordinator for our local festival, to be exact.

I still maintain, that having a Xmarks tent (and I'm not referring to the Clan Cian tent here, before anyone gets offended) really doesn't promote wearing the kilt outside of the games, since you're at the games -- now, directing folks to Xmarksthescot.com with a poster/sign, t-shirt, and a conversation certainly will. But remember, many of these folks may not want to wear a kilt all the time -- for many at the games, the kilt is primarily about heritage (and wearing them to Scottish events) so you may or may not have a receptive audience. Instead, I would emphasise, as Mark mentioned, the camraderie of Xmarks. "If you Build it, they will come".

Again, these are just my thoughts/observations and suggestions -- please do not take them as anymore than that.

Todd

[auld argonian]

Speaking for AA....I suppose that the thing that sort of made me want to sound a cautionary note was, with all respect to Alan H, the mention of any promotion of any of the businesses that are prominent on the forum. Not that all of us aren't grateful to them for their support and sharing of their expertise (and when asked, I always mention as many of them as I can think of to someone who's interested in getting a kilt and suggest that the potential kilt-ee check out their websites) but that it is more of an advocacy group and not a public relations operation for any specific supplier. Todd also mentioned that there were other organizations that help do research for those seeking their connections to clans and tartans...just cautious about stepping on anybody's toes.

Certainly don't mean to sound like I'm discouraging you guys...just overly cautious, i guess

Best

AA

[macwilkin]

Todd's comments are very near to my own point of view about Xmarks...it exist as a sort of kilt-advocacy group and care has to be taken to keep it sort of "neutral" in the kilt hierarchy. It would be unfair to advocate or to even seem to advocate one style of kilt or any particular kiltmakers...the idea is to promote the everyday wearing of the kilt in situations, as it says, other than highland games or celtic fests or whatever. As much fun as it is to spread the word about Xmarks and kiltwearing it's obvious that one would have to tread lightly and respect some of the other organizations' "turf".

I always favor the "soft sell" approach. Buttons or bumper stickers that get them to ask or to look up the URL. I think that you'd be preaching to the choir at highland games...if there's anyone there who DOESN'T own a kilt when they arrive, they'll be seriously thinking about getting one by the time they leave...not to mention the opportunity to make arrangements with one of the vendors present to either buy a ready made on the spot or place an order. The trick is to get those marginally interested or those who aren't quite sure that they can carry it off to come to this forum and get some info and support....not to mention that you guys are some of the funniest and most literate people posting on the web. That's what Xmarks does well...act as a support group.

Best

AA

To further AA's comments:

I've been setting up clan tents now for about 6 years now, and based on my experience, most folks make a quick breeze through clan row, unless they are on a "mission" to find their clan/family (and have usually been sent by someone at the COSCA/SDFA tent) -- And you'll have quite a few folks that will not know what "Xmarks" is and will probably not stop at all.

Also, the games/festival may not classify this type of tent as a traditional "clan" -- so you might end up a "vendor", and have to pay. Not all games are going to understand what you're trying to do either, and as AA said, most folks already at the games are "kilt-friendly" anyway.

I agree with AA: a t-shirt, sticker, etc. will be more effective, because people will stop and ask where you got it, and now you have a captive audience to tell them about Xmarks. Another option would be to take up the rep for Clan Cian for space in his tent, and make a wee sign (laminated) to hang with the Xmarks logo (you'll need to clear that wi' Hank, btw) which might attract visitors' attention. I know the Clan McFritz, a "chum-and-chowder, tounge-in-cheek" group at the games does this: www.mcfritz.com.
It also gives the Xmarks folks a place to hang out, store stuff, etc. I know the Springfield Scots that go to the St. Louis Games usually hang around my tent.

Cheers,

Todd