Legally kilted

[Chris Webb]

... or you could just wear your freakin' kilt to work and enjoy the sense of pride that comes from having the courage and intestinal fortitude to be a trail blazer.

Given the history and heritage that this forum takes such pride in regarding the kilt I find myself amazed at how many men here apply themselves so earnestly to the seeking of permission to wear it. It seems to me that any man needing permission from anyone lacks the prerequisite courage and confidence to wear a kilt in the first place.

Put on your kilt and go to work! No permission, no explanation. If anyone gives you crap then beat your chest and dare them to take it off of you. If you lose your job then so be it, flash them your regimental *** and get a job elsewhere. Obviously there are other places to work kilted or there wouldn't be men on this forum doing it.

Frankly, if you're not willing to lose your job over wearing a kilt then you're not all that committed to wearing a kilt to work anyway. Does anyone on this forum really think that society is just going to change in kiltings' favor with out being forced to? Will saying, "Please, please, pretty please can I wear my man skirt," really going to change anything?

There are men on here who are forcing change. There are men on here who are the only men kilted in the community in which they work and live. There are men on here who are wearing their kilts in front of wives, family and bosses who don't approve of them. There are men on here who refuse to squeeze their balls back into trousers and defy both laws and societal norms that would force them to ...

... these men deserve to wear the kilt. I AM one of these men.

Are you?

Chris Webb

[KiltedCodeWarrior]

Hey Chris, we get it, you are the studliest guy on the forum and can do anything you want.

However, you are not me, or anyone else on the forum, and you don't know the ins and outs of everybody's lives. Certainly anyone could just show at the office wearing a kilt, be fired, and then (hopefully) find another job by walking across the street. Depending on where you are in your life, that might suit you fine. For others, that impact may not just be to themselves, but to their spose, children, and other family members.

Its been brought up before that all of us wear a kilt for different reasons, and at different times and places. SB996 asked for specific legal cases refuting a company's dress code policy based on medical/religious qualifications. If you don't have any helpful information, and want to start a new thread to discuss reasons people wear a kilt, please do so and discontinue ranting on this thread.

I will also point out that discussions like this have taken place in the past and the thread is almost always locked down and/or deleted fairly quickly.

[phinz]

SB996 asked for specific legal cases refuting a company's dress code policy based on medical/religious qualifications

Religious ruling, siding with employee. Head scarf.

Religious ruling, siding with employee. Tattoos this time.

If you can prove medical or religious necessity, then typically your company must make what the courts refer to as "reasonable accomodations". Examples: Turbans for Sikhs. A stool to sit on for an employee who cannot stand for long periods of time because of medical reasons. Regular bathroom breaks for an employee with medical necessity. Abayas for Muslim women. In a business setting, it's a crap shoot whether or not a kilt would have to be accomodated for medical or religious reasons, dependent on whether or not the courts would see the accomodation of a kilt as an "unreasonable burden" on the company.

[Chris Webb]

I stand corrected and accept your declaration as the House Chairman that I am the studliest guy on the forum!

I do also stand by the notion that the very laws SB996 is looking for are insufficient to protect his right to wear a kilt and that said laws will not be changed with out the sacrifice and civil disobedience of at least a handful of kilted men willing to do it. SB996 could be one of that handful.

What you wrote regarding the negative consequences of being one of that handful is absolutely correct and is the very definition of sacrifice. Most people naturally avoid such sacrifices. But it is those who do not who will eventually facilitate the protective laws currently sought after by SB996.

Respectfully submitted,

Chris Webb

[Riverkilt]

...
Put on your kilt and go to work! No permission, no explanation.

Chris Webb

What "rules?" What "statutes." Jeez, this is AMERICA. This thread sure does show the difference between those of us who live in the city and those of us who live in the boonies....hope this is keeping with the tone of this thread.

Can't imagine how or why an American citizen would need some sort of rule or statute to dress as he pleases (yes, yes safety situations and corporate uniforms aside).

As I recall, "go to work! No permission, no explanation" is what women did years ago when it came to their wearing pants in the workplace. Think history will back up my besotted memory.

That's what I did, and it worked. Course living alone I didn't need anyone's permission to kilt up.

I did begin wearing kilts around this boonie town as if it was the most normal thing in the world. And I showed up that way at work too. And when I went full time kilted I just kept showing up kilted every day.

Yes, I had to work through some fears. But I did it and stood proudly kilted.

It works guys.

FREEDOM!

Ron

[bubba]

Y'know, for a nation founded on freedom the US has become over regulated and so terribly conformist. Employers today can declare no smoking by employees even away from work on their own time and have the right to fire anyone who smokes regardless of where and when they light up. Offices are gradually getting away from office casual dress and some are beginning to enforce stricter dress codes. Even on the production floor more companies are starting to require work uniforms. Will kilts be accepted (safety requirements aside)? I doubt it, in fact I expect they'll be prohibited in the workplace in due course.A few service companies may embrace them for the "different" public image, but in general they'll never be accepted as work attire. The fact is, as jobs (especially decent paying jobs) become more scarce employers will become more restrictive. The last thing the corporate world wants is individuals. Now, for a devious tactic. Put your normal work clothes in a gym bag and wear your kilt. Get to work at the very last minute and just get busy. If someone raises hell about the kilt just tell em you were at a breakfast of some Scottish heritage group and you didn't have time to change, but you will as soon as you get an imperative project taken care of. If nobody objects just leave the gym bag under your desk. Sneaky? Of course, but worth a try.

[Raphael]

Working at a company is a priviledge, not a right and every company has a dress code to project an image to the clients/customers they serve.

If you don't like how your company operates, you can always look elsewhere. Just leave on a good term. Please don't tell any potential employers that you left your previous employer because they don't allow you to wear your kilt.

[Riverkilt]

At the risk of drifting....but I think it speaks to the original question.

It is not necessarily a gift that I get to work somewhere. I've had dozens of jobs (a perk of being a practicing alcoholic for many years) and its been my experience that corporate loyalty is expected to flow up from the employees, but is seldom seen flowing back down to them.

Once worked for a large NYSE outfit who fired two long term peers on Christmas Eve by phone because they were "rearranging territories."

I work where I chose to work. I am a professional who by choice has acquired the education, training, experience, licenses, and certifications to make me a desired employee.

Because of this I have resolved to interview kilted should I ever chose to change employers. For me, that avoids all the hassle of worrying about what corporate kilt policy, if any, is.

I just don't want to work for any corporation that does not accept kilts as a male garment.

Will I starve or scrimp by on unemployment because of that? I think not.

There is a kilt fashion boom on, that can't be denied. A simple look at what's happened to the kiltmaking industry and the kilt boards verifys that. The questions we get asked every day veryify that.

Hopefully, this boom is just as strong as the fashion movement that brought pants to women in the workplace.

The parallels are obvious.

The weird control freaks in power with their silly rules are bound to be swept aside by the power of common sense and freedom.

Yes, there are many pioneers out there showing up kilted at work for the first time, fearful of the whims of superiors and their corporations' rules.

Be brave. You will overcome.

The only thing more fearful than wearing a kilt to work for the first time is trying to find a justifiable reason to tell a valued employee, in the year 2006, that he can't do that.

Kilt up!

Ron

[Riverkilt]

Hey SB,

This is pure manipulation...perhaps your company would be more open to kilts if you found yourself a kilt in your company's colors (if they have any) and you called it corporate loyalty...or a great marketing idea...

Ron

[Alan H]

I come at this from a slightly different angle. Keep in mind that while I have a mortgage, I don't have kids and the Missus is working right now. We're not going to lose the house if I happen to be out of work for a couple of months.

OK, here's my philosophy.....MY philosophy, not necessarily your philosophy. I choose where I work. I'm not going to go work for a financial/investment/venture capital firm. The values system in those places don't align with mine, so I'm just not interested. I'm not going to work in a law firm for the same reason. I'm not knocking people who DO work in those sorts of places, it's just that they're not for me, that's all.

OK, so when I look for work, the process is a mutual interview process. They choose me because they think I'll be able to do what they need to get done. I choose them because I like the people, like the work, the pay is acceptable and the goals of the organization are palatable/desireable to me. They choose me, and I choose them.

And so, nowadays, I don't wear a kilt to interviews, but if the first interview goes well, at the en dof it I tell them that A.) I will be taking off 6 weeks of time without pay in the summer of 1998 (to sail to Hawaii) AND 2.) I will wear a kilt to work 1-2 days a week. That puts those cards on the table, where they are part of the negotiating process. So far, none of the places I've interviewed with the exception of one possibility, have seemed to care about either of them. Certainly everyone expresses mild interest about the kilt and sailing, but doesn't really seem to care very much.

If a place I interviewed did NOT want to allow a kilt, then I wouldn't want to work there. What does it say about the organization if something as inocuous as a kilt is verboten? Why would I want to work there, if I could look for another job for a few weeks, even a couple of months and land myself in a place where I'd be a LOT more likely to be happy?

So what I'd say is if your job is just great in every other way, just that they don't allow kilts, then fine, stick with it. I mean, it's JUST A PIECE OF CLOTHING, not a freakin' religion, right? On the other hand, if the "no kilts" edict is indicative of a mindset/policy stance which affects you in other ways that you don't much like, then maybe it's time for a change in scenery. Your call.