Allowed tartans

[bubba]

The whole idea of Clan tartans began with Sir Walter Scott and the King of England. The real tradition was wear whatever appealed to a person, what he could afford and the local weavers were making, the more colors the higher the cost. The Black Watch, otherwise known as the Govt Sett, also is a Grant and Campbell tartan as well as being the basis for many others. Frankly, there is no single true tradition on any of it. Personally, I follow the older idea of wearing what I like that I can afford.

[Hamish]

It truly matters not what tartan you wear, with the exception of 'Balmoral' which is reserved solely for our British Royal Family's personal use. With the proviso that you treat and wear that tartan with respect; that you take the trouble to learn its origins and, if it has one, its meaning - the reasons for the colours used in it. It might also be a considerate step to take if you were to write to the Clan Chief and explain that you wish to wear his/her tartan, giving your reasons - such a request is most unlikely to be refused.

I proudly wear my Clan tartan, Gunn, in two variations - Ancient and Weathered, but I am equally at ease wearing any of the other four Clan tartans, or thirteen regional/national tartans in my Kilt Kollection.

[Tattoo Bradley]

Ya outta get yourself a Henderson tartan Ham

[pdcorlis]

The whole idea of Clan tartans began with Sir Walter Scott and the King of England.

I consider myself pretty wet behind the ears compared to many of the folks on this board so let me heartily suggest you do what I have begun. Try reading a bit of Scottish history - I've yet to run across any source that disagrees with this statement.

[davedove]

Like a lot of people here, I like to have some affiliation with a particular tartan, but that's just so I feel a "connection" to it.

Even if you don't have a connection to a tartan, maybe you would want to honor someone who does. Maybe you had a friend who passed on and you wear his family tartan in his honor. Maybe your father (or, like me, your grandfathers) was in the Navy and you wear that tartan to honor him. Maybe you admire a particular clan and wear their tartan to honor them.

Know and respect whatever tartan you wear.

[M. A. C. Newsome]

Those here who have intimated that te association of tartans to the names of clans and families is a recent thing are correct. The first named tartans did not come about until the late eighteenth century, and even then all indications are that these names were just meant as handy ways to identify a particular pattern and not meant to denote any affiliation.

(To put it in a modern context, we don't think only Cherokee people can drive Jeep Cherokees, do we?)

As recently as one hundred years ago, I have read commentary from Gaelic Highlanders who had never heard of a "clan tartan" and wore whatever tartan they pleased.

On the other hand, it is an undeniable fact that in the modern tradition of Highland Dress, people most certainly do associate tartans with clans, families, places, etc. There are absolutely no rules or laws governing this. It's only a popular custom that has grown up in the minds of romantic Scotophiles.

So my general advice to people is to wear whatever tartan you wish -- but most people choose to wear a tartan that they feel some personal connection to. This connection could be as straightforward as the tartan for your last name. Or it could be the tartan for your mother's name, or a grandmother's name. Or the district tartan of the state or town you were born in. Or the district tartan for the place your name originated in. Or the tartan of a clan of a very dear friend. Or... or... or...

The point is that when people see you wearing a tartan, they are going to ask you about it, and it really helps to have a nice story to tell. But there are no tartan police (though many people may act like it!). You'll never get in trouble for wearing the "wrong" tartan.

An example of where it helps to know your stuff about tartans is your comment about the Black Watch. You wrote that the Black Watch should be reserved for people who served in the Black Watch, or had other military service. While the Black Watch tartan certainly will have special meaning for Black Watch soliders, veterans, and their descendants, it is also the tartan used by the Clan Campbell, the Clan Grant, the Clan Munroe, as a district tartan for the Sutherland region, and also under the name "government sett" is has been the basis for countless other military and clan tartans.

This tartan is one of the ones commonly listed for "general use" by those with no tartan of their own, along with Hunting Stewart, Jacobite, Flower of Scotland and others. It is one of the most common tartans in the rental industry. You can buy pajamas and underwear in this tartan, for goodness' sake!

To illustrate how ridiculous some people can be about this, I have a friend who has a Black Watch kilt. He is a member of Clan Grant (his last name is Grant), and as I said, this tartan is used as a clan tartan by the Grants. Also, his father was a Black Watch soldier. So the tartan has double signifigance to him.

He was wearing his kilt at a recent Highland Games, and a person ran up to him (not kilted) and demanded to know why he was wearing "his" clan tartan. My friend began to explain to this man that this was the Black Watch tartan, and his father had served...

No! the gentleman yelled. That's the Murray tartan! This man was from clan Murray and wanted to know what gave my friend the right to wear his tartan! (Notice that he didn't even ask if my friend happened to be a Murray -- he just assumed).

So my friend once more tried to explain that this was not the Murray tartan, and it was in fact the Black Watch tartan, and he was wearing it because...

But no, the man continued to harass him, so my friend just politely excused himself and walked away. In the end, it was the harasser that was embarassing himself, in his feeble attempt at policing what other people wore.

Even if this crazy gentlemen were correct and my friend was wearing the Murray tartan, how was he to know that he was not descended from Clan Murray, no matter how distant? You just never know.

And for that matter, even if you have a staightforward name like MacDonald, that still is no guarantee that you are actually descended from the Clan MacDonald. All it means is that you are descended from a man named Donald, and he could have been Donald of Clan Campbell for all you know!

So take it all with a grain of salt, and try not to get too uptight about it. If all else fails wear solid colors!

[MacWage]

. . .

Unidentified
Unnamed
Wilsons

http://www.tartans.scotland.net/tart...?tartan_id=299

I hope this helps.


Phoenix Phil

THE reason that many of the unnamed tartans are "Wilsons" is that one of/the premier tartan weaver of the late 18th/early 19th century was Wilson and Sons of Bannokburn (near Stirling and the site of a rather significant famous battle). He/They was one of the first to name tartans after clans and was the "go to" firm for clan chiefs to ID "their" tartans or to weave ones "found" in the clan territories. Earlier, Wilson's used numbers to ID the tartans,but names were more romantic and sold better. Many Wilson's tartans are now clan tartans. Some in the early Wilsons sample books are actually DIFFERENT clan tartans than those known today and some are even DIFFERENT clans entirely. Thus, many tartans were made and sold by the firm that are historical, but now "un-linked" to a particular association.

Be warned though, SOME tartans are legally restricted to certain persons, such as a golf club's members or some particular clan tartans, like that of Harden of Cowenknowles. For the latter, MAKE SURE you get PERMISSION first. Most, fortunately, are not so restricted.

That said, think of tartans as team colors. If I was an NFL (American Football) fan and pulled for the Atlanta Falcons, I would wear red, black, and silver. For the Green Bay Packers, I would wear green and yellow. A friend of mine is a BIG Buffalo Bills fan. Once he wore a pullover that was orange and green. I kidded him about wearing Miami Dolphins (the Bills biggest rival) colors and he LITERALLY removed the shirt and BURNED IT in front of me. For Brits, think Liverpool and Manchester or Rangers and Celtic.

If you wear a tartan, you are supporting what that tartan represents (clan, region, group, et cetera). Most tartan/kilt wearers know this innately, others are clueless (most of the latter never find this forum, much less join). Be prepared to know the tartan, what it means/represents, and a logical/reasonable rational for wearing that tartan.

[macwilkin]

I consider myself pretty wet behind the ears compared to many of the folks on this board so let me heartily suggest you do what I have begun. Try reading a bit of Scottish history - I've yet to run across any source that disagrees with this statement.

The statement is a little too general for me; whilst the 1822 state visit by George VI, the British Monarch (he wasn't just the "King of England") and Sir Walter's efforts certainly influenced the tartan trade a great deal, I think it is more historically correct to say that the various weaving firms like Wilson's of Bannockburn share in the responsibility for the invention of the "clan tartan", along with the Chiefs themselves and the Highland Society of London!

One need look no further than Matt Newsome's web site for a history:

http://www.albanach.org/sources.htm

As always in history, there's much more to the story.

Thread has been moved, btw, to the heraldry and tartans section of the forum. Please post all tartan related threads here.

Regards,

Todd

[beloitpiper]

Wow, this got really heated, really fast.

First of all, I never claimed that there was some great Tome of Tartans in a dusty castle in Scotland that had the "rules" written down. I'm just one for tradition and custom. Thus, I prefer a tartan that can be associated with the wearer. Don't be angry for making up rules. All i stated was my opinion.

And what davedove said:

Even if you don't have a connection to a tartan, maybe you would want to honor someone who does. Maybe you had a friend who passed on and you wear his family tartan in his honor. Maybe your father (or, like me, your grandfathers) was in the Navy and you wear that tartan to honor him.

Makes a lot of sense. I totally agree with that. I just get a bit irritated when people buy a SportKilt in a random tartan because 'they like the colors'. Lynch me if you wish, this is how I feel.

Know what you're wearing, don't be ignorant, have pride and dignity in your tartan.

[MacWage]

Trust me, on this forum you need to be specific in what you say. People read into it. My first reaction was: "blowhard, he must not know much about the history of tartan." I planned to just ignor it. Yet, as a read the posts, I thought I could contribute in a positive way. I'm glad that I had misread the original post and what you meant was "appropriation of tartans without regard to their history and without honor to what they signify."

I have "title" to several tartans, including Gordon (through the Todd family, which is -to me- questionable historically). Of these I prefer the ones that are families I like, nice looking, and can find affordably. One of my belted plaids is in Dress Gordon, which I use as a more formal wear.

The problem is that Dress Gordon is nice looking and extremly easy to get your hands on cheap, so it is often misused and worn by "know nothings."

Be warned, this board has very few know nothings, a number of blowhards, and many who are VERY knowledgable and considerate. If treated without respect, we can pounce like a ravenous rabid dog . But, if there there is respect and posts are considerate, you can be well recieved :mrgreen: .

Welcome to the board.