what makes metal, metal........

[Dreadbelly]

The moment you put metal in to catagories, it is no longer metal. It is commercialised prepackaged formulated hard pop.

Real metal died in the 80s. Nu-Metal came about in the 90s because studio execs wanted to appeal to the vacuum that the grunge movement left behind.

[cloves]

i work at a cd store...and man that metal from the 80's....ain't metal at all compared to the scary stuff out there today. There is a whole new genre of music called "extreme metal." Within that there are sub forms, death metal, black metal, thrash metal, d-beat, drone and the list goes on. I can't tell which is which, but appaerntly to real fans of the style, they can tell what's what just by listening to the tones, tempo, lyrics and so on.

[Dreadbelly]

I rest my case. The stuff today is not metal. It is decended from metal, no doubt, and some of it is quite good. It is just not metal. Metal began in the 60s (Arguably) gained substance in the 70s, as well as losing its soul with stadium rock, and fizzled out in the 80s. The moment the term "Hair Metal" was coined, the movement died. Completely. Grunge came along and brought back the best of punk and metal from the 70s in hybrid form. And the moment it was lept upon and commercialised, it died to... Right about the same time Kurt had his brains blown out.

Spinal Tap was kind of the nail in the coffin for metal. At that point, self parody was just about all that was left. It had become absurd and bloated. Execs were labeling it and it was coming out in neat little prepackaged apps designed to appeal to various social cliques in clean and tidy formulated for success packages.

This one goes to 11

[LK-13]

i work at a cd store...and man that metal from the 80's....ain't metal at all compared to the scary stuff out there today. There is a whole new genre of music called "extreme metal." Within that there are sub forms, death metal, black metal, thrash metal, d-beat, drone and the list goes on. I can't tell which is which, but appaerntly to real fans of the style, they can tell what's what just by listening to the tones, tempo, lyrics and so on.

I dare you to say that to Lemmi Von Killmister!! :soda:

"you know I'm going to loose
and gamblin' is for fools
but,
that's the way i like it baby
i don't want to live forever!!"

[Dreadbelly]

I dare you to say that to Lemmi Von Killmister!! :soda:

"you know I'm going to loose
and gamblin' is for fools
but,
that's the way i like it baby
i don't want to live forever!!"

The Ace of Spades... The Ace of Spades...

"Welcome to Hell child. We listen to metal."

[cloves]

I don't get it...why exactly isn't the stuff today considered metal to you?
er...let me rephrase..."What makes metal, metal?"

[Dreadbelly]

Because the stuff today isn't metal... It is decended from metal.

Look at it this way. I have Sicilian blood. But I wasn't born in Sicily. I am decended from Sicilians, but I am not a Sicilian. From Sicily.

Nu-Metal is much the same. Decended from metal, but metal it is not. The moment you have to catagorise it, it is no longer metal. Stuff now is a completely different beast. Some good, some bad, but the moment somebody calls it death metal, or grind metal, or speed metal, it is no longer metal. It is a Sicilian American. Or something to that effect. However, adding a title to it automatically makes it self mockery and parody. (See Spinal Tap) Metal was hardcore. Parody or self mockery is something you point your finger at and laugh. People seem to forget that metal died, so the joke really is on them.

You can't dust for vomit.

[cloves]

Can one of the mods move mine and Dreads posts from the "deathmetal sporran" thread to here for me? I got a bit carried away. Sorry Beuth

[Nanook]

Real metal died in the 80s. Nu-Metal came about in the 90s because studio execs wanted to appeal to the vacuum that the grunge movement left behind.

Metal never existed beyond its function as marketing gag. 1970s Metal? That was the crap at Gazzari's and a load of unhip teenies from the Valley...
What great "classic metal" bands do you suggest? Black Sabbath? A wannabe Jazz band that got enticed by money. Led Zeppelin? Same story.. with the genes of the Yardbirds and The Who. Deep Purple? I remember Jon Lord.. also a background in jazz and even at the height of Deep Purple an interest more in Modern Composition than in Pop which led in the late 1960s to some pop-classical fusion attempts.. Ritchie Blackmore? Rainbow--- named after also my then time haunt on the Strip.. Before even these bands went to the mystery graveyard, the hip $ound was glitter.. by this time with their lights browned out.. With the execs pumping money like there was no tomorrow to sell Bowie to a naive public.. and it worked.. Punk did not follow metal.. John Lyndon wanted to sound like the Ramones.. and their riffs follow the tracks to Iggy Pop and New York Dolls.. really glam and glitter in the gutter..
There was, of course, a whole scene of "metal" in the East Bloc.. I remember hanging out in camping grounds with intellectual "freaks" from all over Eastern Europe listing to forbidden music (recall Charter 77) and performance.. Their inspiration was not any of these bands but Zapa (early Zapa and Captain Beefheart) and Warhol (Velvet Underground).

[ckelly327]

I understand what Dread is trying to say. I was never a huge metal head but there was definitely a different vibe to the metal of the early 70's than what you hear today. "Heavy Metal" to me will always be bands like Black Sabbath, Blue Oyster Cult, Iron Butterfly, Judas Priest and even AC/DC. They created the genre and then the hair bands came along and tried to make everything generic. I really don't "get" a lot of the stuff today that is being passed off as metal. Speed Metal? Might as well be some of the techno pop that I can't listen to either. While I still listen to a radio station that plays alternative music (including some modern metal), I will still revert to my 70's punk collections when I'm home alone but that's a whole different debate on what happened to punk over the years.