Allowed tartans

[Barclay]

Oh, I would just love to have someone tell me I can't wear a tartan because it's "theirs".

All of my kilts are tartans that have meaning for me, and none of them are family tartans from either side. In fact, the last family kilt that I had, my Mum paid for when I was about 13.

One of my favorite kilts is a Colquhoun 8-yarder that I bought from MAC Newsome (he did not make it - it was ordered from another vendor and the purchaser returned it for some reason. It fit, Matt gave me a deal on it - I have a nice 8 yard kilt.) At a games event last year I had a man from that Clan come up and talk to me and ask my Clan affiliation. I told him that I had none, and I just really liked the tartan and got a good deal on the kilt. He told me that as a Clan officer he was ordering me to take the kilt off and give it to him. I didn't know how to respond till with a little wink he followed up with "we look like we're about the same size". He didn't care, neither do I. I'll wear his clan colours, and I'll wear them proudly, simply because I like that tartan.

I'm with you guys - and if I see someone wearing my Clan tartans (Barclay and MacQueen/Chattan), I'll raise a glass, give 'em a nod and recognize them as a kinsman by virtue of being in my Clan colours, regardless of name or bloodline.

[Peter C.]

All of my kilts are tartans that have meaning for me, and none of them are family tartans from either side. In fact, the last family kilt that I had, my Mum paid for when I was about 13.

One of my favorite kilts is a Colquhoun 8-yarder that I bought from MAC Newsome (he did not make it - it was ordered from another vendor and the purchaser returned it for some reason. It fit, Matt gave me a deal on it - I have a nice 8 yard kilt.) At a games event last year I had a man from that Clan come up and talk to me and ask my Clan affiliation. I told him that I had none, and I just really liked the tartan and got a good deal on the kilt. He told me that as a Clan officer he was ordering me to take the kilt off and give it to him. I didn't know how to respond till with a little wink he followed up with "we look like we're about the same size". He didn't care, neither do I. I'll wear his clan colours, and I'll wear them proudly, simply because I like that tartan.

I'm with you guys - and if I see someone wearing my Clan tartans (Barclay and MacQueen/Chattan), I'll raise a glass, give 'em a nod and recognize them as a kinsman by virtue of being in my Clan colours, regardless of name or bloodline.

That is like a breath of fresh air Barclay. And funny.

I was reading another thread where some established multi-kilted xmarkers were discussing a picture of a kilt with comments like, what a lovely tartan thats going on my wish list. They are saying that they are going to get a kilt because they like the tartan, which is saying in not so many words that they like the colours. That is certainly my main reason for getting a kilt in any particular tartan.

Peter

[RK-REX]

All of my kilts are tartans that have meaning for me, and none of them are family tartans from either side. In fact, the last family kilt that I had, my Mum paid for when I was about 13.

One of my favorite kilts is a Colquhoun 8-yarder that I bought from MAC Newsome (he did not make it - it was ordered from another vendor and the purchaser returned it for some reason. It fit, Matt gave me a deal on it - I have a nice 8 yard kilt.) At a games event last year I had a man from that Clan come up and talk to me and ask my Clan affiliation. I told him that I had none, and I just really liked the tartan and got a good deal on the kilt. He told me that as a Clan officer he was ordering me to take the kilt off and give it to him. I didn't know how to respond till with a little wink he followed up with "we look like we're about the same size". He didn't care, neither do I. I'll wear his clan colours, and I'll wear them proudly, simply because I like that tartan.

I'm with you guys - and if I see someone wearing my Clan tartans (Barclay and MacQueen/Chattan), I'll raise a glass, give 'em a nod and recognize them as a kinsman by virtue of being in my Clan colours, regardless of name or bloodline.

[DamnthePants]

Forgive me for posting out of the blue, but when you learn a new piece of information, its hard not to share it.

I just got finished a rather lengthy history of the Highlands book, and one passage comes to mind when I read this.

There is at least some historical evidence that clans were not required to ware a certain tartan based on their family. The way it –probably-(as the book surmises, please note I do not claim this is fact, just food for thought) was; was that families wore what ever they had made. Be it the same pattern, a similar pattern, or one that was completely different. The big houses however, would most likely have the money and authority to have sets. So the House of Ramsey would have commissioned a kilt for all of his members to wear in his house, but other Ramsey not part of the household would wear what ever they could get their hands on.

Lets say over the course of time this one Ramsey clan house becomes the most famous, people take note of the fact that they ware a kilt of a certain pattern at certain times, and boom, you got the idea that each clan had its own kilt, and that’s the only one they could ware. When logically it probably isn’t true

The book also mentioned ( a little rudely phrased) “The idea that people could identify clans based on a complex interwoven pattern is laughable”


Don’t shoot the messenger, I am just offering up food for thought.

For me personally, I look at Clan Tartans as I do clothing of today. I can wear Armani with out being Italian, I can wear Cashmere with out being Asian.

If its fall and here in Maine there’s lots of colorful foliage, I might wear a Buchanan Kilt, as it just looks so right, were as in spring, a lighter colored Douglas kilt would look better.

That’s just me though, and in no way am I trying to disrespect anyone who would feel bad about me wearing their family tartan. The least I can do is at least know what family it is when they ask. I would feel a little irritated if someone was wearing a Ross tartan and when I asked about it they just called it Plaid.

[majdan]

As said by Perter C:

"Does this make me one of the most idiotic of tartan wearers who have no sense of what they are doing? These are very strong words as there are actually no rules. Do we have to bide by YOUR rules? Are YOU the tartan police?"


I to have read this thread from start to finish. If I remember what the original context, MacWage's point was that we all make our own rules but they only apply to ourselves. In the end we all have to make some delination among the tartans as to what we wear and what we don't. There are no rules so we have to make them up for ourselves for application only to ourselves. There are thousands of Tartans and even Hamish only has 80 kilts. That is a very small sample from all the possibilities.

I have my own little set of rules from which limit my possible choices. One of these is and Sett that in conected to a clan that I can get the yardage cheap. A case in point is the kilt that I made out of a flannel bed sheet. To the best of my knowledge it is the tartan of the clan MacBedsheet. It is serviceable, doesn't look too bad, and I learned a lot in making it. If I were out in my MacBedsheet kilt and some stranger happened to tell me that I was wearing his clans' tartan it would be the start of a great conversation and a couple drinks no doubt and I would have added to my kilted knowledge base. That's part of the fun. We's all Kilties after all.

[ChromeScholar]

To the best of my knowledge it is the tartan of the clan MacBedsheet.

Well, thank you very much! You now owe me a new keyboard, as I spit coffee all over this one...

[Makeitstop]

*tosses in a pair of pennies*

I can honestly say I don't really care about tradition (any tradition, not just this one) and even if there was a big book of rules regarding the wearing of tartans, I still wouldn't care. Unless something is actually, objectively, morally wrong, I tend to be fairly pragmatic, and when that isn't an issue, I just go with my own tastes. So, when considering tartans I only care about how much that kilt will cost, how durable it will be, how it will feel on a hot sunny day, and finally whether or not I think it is ugly as hell.

I suppose it would be good to know the basic associations of the tartan I'm wearing if I am going to be some place where the issue is likely to come up, but as I live far behind enemy lines in the war on pants, I would be shocked if anyone even mentioned the fact that the tartan on my kilt might mean something. They are more interested in why I'm so weird, if I'm a cross dresser or just seeking attention, and whether or not they are going to get a show on a windy day. If I let other people's views and associations dictate my clothing, I wouldn't be concerned about tartans because I would just wear pants.

And even if I did care about traditions, I would still have trouble with this one because I feel very little connection to my ancestors. I'm a mutt, as I am descended from most of europe, some native american tribes, numerous historical figures, and many people of unknown origin. There's some scottish in there (have no clue about clans or anything else of the sort) but I'm not really going to feel connected to my kilt because of my ancestors, or vice versa. About the only thing in my family tree I can honestly say I am proud of is a fire breathing, dragon slaying werewolf who apparently was a real person, and with whom I seem to have a lot in common. If you can find that tartan, I will wear it with pride, otherwise I'm just not feeling it. Not to mention that with my budget, the number of tartans I can choose from is in the single digits.

Of course, if a tartan said something else, then I would want to know. I doubt there is a tartan for registered sex offenders, or one which claims I am a congressional medal of honor recipient, but if there were, I would rather not wear that one. And I did check and found there is no ninja tartan, so I may have to correct that.

Of course, this is a non-issue for me anyway, as I prefer solid colors. I will probably get a few tartan kilts just to have a little more variety (I wouldn't mind wearing the nightstalker tartan from stillwater) but for the most part, I'd rather just wear something in a nice solid black.

So if you take pride in what your tartan stands for, great. I wish I could feel the same way, but I don't. So as long as I you don't bug me for wanting to wear something just to feel pretty, I won't bug you for getting all excited about/emotionally invested in some random assortment of stripes. I mean honestly, aren't there more important things for us all to worry about?

[Perldog007]

I wish that the Beatty Modern were a universal fashion tartan. Then I could get one from Jerry V. for 80-125 bucks instead of the roughly 1100 dollars I can't seem to raise at the moment.

I wouldn't care if anybody else wore it, not even Paris Hilton. (O.K. maybe her and Alec Baldwin - but anybody else would be cool)

I just got my first tartan with a family affiliation, perhaps. Weathered Mackenzie from Stillwater. As Macbeth is listed as a sept of Mackenzie.... BUT I GOT IT BECUASE IT LOOKED SO COOL AND I COULD AFFORD IT.

[Panache]

Makeitstop,

You have posted your two cents, so here are mine.

There are fabric choices out there that are a LOT less expensive and far more durable than tartan, especially quality wool tartan. Part of the beauty of tartan is that it can stand for something. A tartan can represent a piece of history, honor a group, or stand for an ideal


Take a piece of Campbell / Black Watch tartan in your hands.

It can represent those that fought for the English Crown against their people,

It can represent generations of brave soldiers who fought with distinction and valor,

It can represent a family's history and unity,

It can represent an enemy and bloody deeds never forgotten,

and many other things both good and bad.

There in your hand is pride, honor, villainy, family, loyalty, blood, death, bravery, honor, and above all HISTORY!

With the internet so much information is available, so quickly, for so little effort. If one would take the time to choose a tartan to wear it seems a shame to not invest a moment more to know what that tartan represents.

I am not a Campbell and I have no connection to the Black Watch Regiment. But I wear this tartan in a full 8 yard knife pleated kilt with respect to those two groups. My ancestors were not slain by the Campbells but I know that this deed happened and there are those that to this day see that association. How richer this fabric is for all this history. I wear my grey Utilikilt and enjoy it for it's practicality, comfort, good looks, and as a representation of my individuality. But my tartan kilts have this added dimension.

One of the wonderful things about tartans is that besides warps and wefts there is history woven into that cloth. I think that one should wear whatever tartan you like (with a few exceptions). To not take that moment to understand the history or meaning of a tartan isn't just a matter of disrespect. It is to have something and not get the full enjoyment and appreciation of it.

Respectfully

Jamie

[Bryan]

I'm new on these forums, but here's my opinion.

Growing up I always had some weird obsession with all things Scottish/Irish. Music, dress, food, anything. At the age of 10ish I asked if we had any Scottish/Irish blood in the family and was told, "No, you're German (my mother is from Germany by way of an American father/German mother and my father's family is originally from Germany)" and I grew up steeped in German culture and tradition, which I am fiercely proud of. But there remained my fascination with the Celtic lands.

As I got older I wanted a kilt badly, but couldn't rationalize wearing one as I wasn't Scottish. I eventually got married to a lovely girl of Scottish/Irish descent and finally had my reason to wear a kilt/tartan. So, I got my one and only kilt in HER family's tartan which happens to be Lamont. I thought, "Hey, I married into her family, right?"

After a little research recently, I discovered that I do indeed have Scottish ancestry on my mother's side (her Grandmother was a Butters, an old Scottish family long associated with Clan Murray) so I've decided to get another kilt made in my own clan's tartan.

Now we come to my opinion. I chose tartans that has some special meaning for ME. Whether it's my family's tartan or my spouse's tartan, or something like the Confederate Memorial Tartan, which for me as a born and raised Texan, means a lot because it is part of the history of my state. Choosing another tartan completely, is more than fine. Wear it proudly and enjoy it!

Being German, it wouldn't offend me to see someone who isn't German "parading" around in Lederhosen, drinking German beer, and eating Schnitzel.

Apologies in advance if I've repeated anything anyone else said, 19 pages of posts is a lot to get through.