Here We go

[Mael Coluim]

from the Old Dominion State!

[SteveB]

Alex,
First from the other side of the continent, Boston, Massachusetts.
Second: 11 oz P/V is the kilt weight. It will have a different swish factor than the 16 oz. wool, but not by much. The main feature for P/V is the way it can be cleaned, making it great for everyday wear kilts.

[RockyR]

I've seen what people are calling 16 oz PV. The kilts are made in Pakistan and are being re-sold (or wholesaled) through the Gold Brothers or one of their other business names / umbrella companies (Get Shirty, Highland Heritage, etc).

The kilts MAY be 16 oz PV (that's the fabric composition and weight they claim), but the quality of the fabric (not all PV fabric is created equal) is very poor and the weave is not very tight. The OTHER clue that it's a pakistani kilt from the GB is that the pricepoint is $100 USD or so.

There is a source for Canadian Tartans in PV IN CANADA. I honestly forget the name of the mill, but the man ONLY sells to Canadian companies and the fabric weight is only 8 or 9 oz PV (VERY light).

[Jack Daw]

Welcome to the jungle, Rainsford. I'm from Houston, TX, and I hope you like it here.

[brad.hutchins]

Lets start off with a "Welcome to the forum", it's never a dull day around here.

I've debated over the last several months whether I wanted to make my "feelings" known on the whole "where it's sourced from" or "what it's made of" debate, here on X Marks. It's tough, as it is a very polarizing subject to some.

In that sense, it is much like religion. You can't argue against a persons faith, by the very nature of faith and their beliefs, they won't be swayed. With that given, I believe everyone is allowed to believe what they will, and have faith in each of their own religions (although I don't count Scientology as a faith or religion....don't get me started there...)

So I decided a while ago, to take a similar stance on these two arguments. I can understand each sides points, but I won't try to argue or debate or try to win anyone over from one side to the other.

First off....am I a distribution house.....no.....and yes. My wife and I own a very small store that just opened up six months ago, in Manassas Virginia. It is completed self funded....with a little help from my credit cards. So...we are not a franchise, we are not a drop shipper, nor are we front for any company or organization. We do not pretend to be anything we are not. So no....we am not a distribution house for any company that is trying to hide their source or presence.

But yes....I am a distribution house, in the sense that I am a retail store owner. I buy and sell kilts and other Scottish and Celtic products. I wish I had the time and skill to make the kilts I sell....but I do not. I do have a passion for my heritage, for comfortable clothing, and for getting out of IT security consulting (which I have done for 15 years, and still do, in order to pay the bills at home).

My company and store (both physical and on the web) were founded on the precepts that we can help a person be kilted, whether it be for their heritage, for comfort, for fashion....or for any reason......at a price point they can afford.

Yes, I have kilts made of medium weave poly-viscous...is the fabric as nice as that provided by Marton Mills....no....is it acrylic......absolutely not (I have received samples from various sources of acrylic kilts.....I am not a fan of them). Are they decent kilts, well made, at a price that many can afford....absolutely, yes.

Will they ever be mistaken for a tank.....no. Nor do I try and sell them as such. Which is exactly the reason I can measure and take orders for House of Edgar and Lochcarron. I have many customers come in looking for for traditional Scottish kilts. They know what to expect on price, and they wouldn't buy one of the cheap kilts in place of it.

But many people cannot afford $500 plus for a traditional 8-9 yard wool kilt. Hell...many can't even afford the casual 5 yard kilts at $330. But they do want to get into a kilt...and it can be any reason from heritage to fashion.

So I try to offer a little bit for everyone.

And you know....many folks that start with a low cost kilt, come back.....they want the tank....they want the family tartan....(the low cost traditional kilts are only available in 16 optional tartans/colors/patterns). These are stepping stones for many people.

I have never tried to hide, nor broadcast where anything is sourced. Ask me and yee shall receive a straight answer. I will tell you this up front....all of my purchases are made from US based and Scotland/UK based, companies.

There is one company I purchase inventory from in Scotland that is, like this argument, a very polarizing source. Do they get their lower cost items outside of the UK....yes. Will I broadcast it here....no....it's not for me to make that decision for them.....When you come into the store, and ask...will I tell you....sure. I'm not trying to hide it. I will also say this......to my knowledge....they are not made in Pakistan.

(tangent on.......I have received samples from Pakistani companies...some have great workmanship, others not so much...all like the acrylic fabrics which I am not a fan of...all are difficult or next to impossible to deal with, for a small store, with very little cash reserves. None of which I have any intention of dealing with in the future....tangent off)

I do business with them because they allow me to offer a wide range of products and price points. I do business with them because they have been good to do business with. They have treated me fairly....and they offer a product line that allows someone....who is just getting started with their own business....that I can afford to carry.

I have also referred folks to other kilt companies, if they are looking for something I can't supply. I have told many customers to look at USA Kilts, Freedom Kilts, Neokilt and more. These groups make excellent kilts. I'd love to be able to carry inventory of their products at some point in the future but in talking with them can respect how they want their business to grow, to run, and selling through a retailer is not what they were looking for. If you'd like a custom measured, hand made kilt, made in the North America, of wool or of the finer poly-viscous materials....any of these groups will set you up right.

In closing, I have many sources, styles and products....kilts from Lochcarron, House of Edgar, Heritage of Scotland (Gold Brothers), Utilikilt, Sportkilt and Amerikilt......I have belts, buckles and other accessories from Glen Esk and GM Belt Supplies, pewter gifts from English Pewter in the UK, jewelry from Sterling Moon and Oberon Designs, pendants and treasure boxes from Andrew McGavin Designs....I even have tartan wool and products from the company that designed the tartans for the movies Braveheart and Rob Roy......and much more.

If, by having the cheaper kilts in my store, it means I have taken sides, in your view....then so be it...perhaps by not taking sides...we have ended up taking a side. But please know....we have so much more to offer, we are in this because of our heritage, because we want to work for ourselves, because we want to offer something to everyone....and hopefully have some fun and make a few $$$ in the process.

We are becoming more involved with the mid-Atlantic Scottish and Irish communities and hope to remain a positive, and welcomed, member of X Marks The Scot.

Let the flames begin.

Brad Hutchins
The Kilted Nation

[brad.hutchins]

To be clear, after getting in the store, tag states:

65% viscose rayon
35% acetate fiber

viscose rayon definition:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rayon
http://www.swicofil.com/viscose.html
http://www.fibersource.com/f-tutor/rayon.htm

Acetate definition:

http://www.apparelsearch.com/definit...definition.htm

These are certainly not acrylic kilts.
http://www.fabrics.net/manufact.asp


I will change the product descriptions to match but with poly implying a blend, and viscose also being known as rayon...check it out...there are many thread on X Marks that talks about this.....

now if the tags are wrong....and they could be....that's another story...but I'll stick with it for now.

Brad Hutchins
The Kilted Nation

Hmmmm... "The Kilted Nation" is advertising a line of kilts in 16 oz. PV:

http://www.kiltednation.com/home.php?cat=53

[ChattanCat]

Brad,
I appreciate your honesty and your business postition. We are all here with something to offer and yours is part of a hole. Without the budget kilts, many would not have the opportunity to afford a kilt. Without the custom made tanks, well, we just wouldn't have something to really jones about.

All we ask is honesty here. I believe, based on your responses, that you are honest. Mistakes are made and corrections are encouraged. It is unfortunate that you did not consult the experts here before posting your add. We certainly could have avioded this hole thread.

We are a free speaking, family friendly, site where we can all share our interest in all things kilted.

BTW,
from the center of the USA!

[James MacMillan]

from Sunny Southern California.

[Riverkilt]

Tell you what. I've followed Brad's Kilted Nation growth and wondered if there's not an MBA thesis laying around for someone.

Here's the kilt industry solidly based in marketing internationally by Internet, at Ren Faires, and highland games. Then this guy comes along and plops a kilt focused retail store in a suburban area (as opposed to the retail kilt shops in tourist areas in Scotland) to carry OTHER people's products.

There's for sure a different approach happening in that Kilted Nation is so kilt focused as opposed to other Scottish/Irish/Celtic retail stores.

I'm enjoying this adventure.

And I'm also appreciating how Brad is sorting through potential vendors then offering up the best in his shop.

How many times have we seen posts by well meaning new kilties who bought into kilt scam artist's flowery promises and wound up with no money and no kilt or a very poorly made kilt?

If I lived near the store I'd be dropping by to talk kilts and find out what's new out in the kilt making world. And for sure, even on this board I'm appreciative of the research Brad's doing and sharing.

I own Utilikilts, SportKilts, and AmeriKilts. Bought them early on, back before I knew a little bit about what I was doing. If I'd lived near Brad and known about Kilted Nation I'd probably have stopped in and ordered through him. Doing business the first time with someone on line that you don't know is sometimes an act of extreme faith in your fellow man.

And for sure it would have been nice to get measured up first by someone who knew how to measure for each kilt maker and (gasp!!) be able to TRY ON a kilt for size before purchase then TAKE IT HOME right then instead of jones for three months (my first UK).

I'm kinda interested to see if Brad's overly optimistic or crazy in love with kilts or if other similar kilt stores start to pop up with multiple lines of kilts available.

Sorry, I don't really recall what the thread topic is...and I'll lose all this if I go look...

Ron

[Chrissss]

I'm glad Brad dropped in on this thread.

I've purchased 4 kilts from Brad (Kilted Nation), 2 Utilikilts, 1 Amerikilt, and I just last week ordered one of his new 16 oz PV kilts in the Heritage of Ireland tartans.

Brad has been great to deal with in all my purchases, especially considering he is quite a distance from me here in Winnipeg. When I asked Brad about the cloth he stated it is superior to the acrylics out there (of which I have 2, both SWK's). I trust Brad's opinion on the product and he assures me that I'll be happy with the kilt.

I agree with Brad's philosophy regarding affordable kilts. Would I like to own several 16 oz tanks? You bet, but at their prices I sure wouldn't wear them "casually" for fear of damaging them. If I snag or spill on a $100 kilt I would be far less upset than if it happened to a $600 hand sewn tank.

Chris...