To kilt or not to kilt: A St. Paddy's Day conundrum

**vespa** · 7th March 08, 07:56 PM

The source I read that in is Electricscotland.com It states he was born in Dumbarton, in the west of Scotland in about the year 372 of the Christian era. His Father Calpurnius it is supposed, came to Scotland in a civil capacity with the Roman troops. If you like you can read more on the Electricscotland website under the heading "History" then "Significant Scots" then "Patrick, Saint".

slainte

Mark

**macwilkin** · 7th March 08, 08:25 PM

Originally Posted by vespa

The source I read that in is Electricscotland.com It states he was born in Dumbarton, in the west of Scotland in about the year 372 of the Christian era. His Father Calpurnius it is supposed, came to Scotland in a civil capacity with the Roman troops. If you like you can read more on the Electricscotland website under the heading "History" then "Significant Scots" then "Patrick, Saint".

slainte

Mark

As Rathdown mentioned, there are several other theories of the origin of the "Patricks":

Somerset: http://www.vortigernstudies.org.uk/a...uestjelley.htm

Wales: http://www.bbc.co.uk/wales/southwest...patricks.shtml

Regards,

Todd

**MacMillan of Rathdown** · 7th March 08, 09:47 PM

Originally Posted by vespa

The source I read that in is Electricscotland.com It states he was born in Dumbarton, in the west of Scotland in about the year 372 of the Christian era. His Father Calpurnius it is supposed, came to Scotland in a civil capacity with the Roman troops. If you like you can read more on the Electricscotland website under the heading "History" then "Significant Scots" then "Patrick, Saint".

slainte

Mark

Mark,
I think ElectricScotland may have blown a fuse... the Patrick they mention (born in 372AD) would have been 122 years old when the historical St. Patrick died in 492. That's remarkably old, even by today's standards. Had the historical St. Patrick lived that long it would not have escaped mention in the Irish Annals.

It is likely that the contributor to ElectricScotland has confused the birth date of Palladius, also called Patrick, First Bishop of Ireland (who died according to the Annals in 461 at the ripe old age of 89) with the younger Romano-Britain Patrick who succeeded Palladius in his ministry and died (according to the Annals) in 492.

The time-line works like this (based on the Annals):

Palladius/Patrick arrives in Ireland in 432;
Patrick the Britain arrives in Ireland in 457;
Palladius/Patrick dies in Ireland in 461;
Patrick the Britain dies in Ireland in 492

Because Patrick the Britain was at least 22 years old when he arrived in Ireland (he was sixteen when sold into slavery and spent six years in Ireland before escaping) he would have been born no later than 435.

And where was Patrick the Britain from? According to the man himself he was from Bannevem Taburniae; his grandfather, Potitus, was a priest and Patrick the Britain's father, Calpornius, was a deacon and decurio (a member of the municipal council).

Nowhere in his CONFESSION does Patrick the Britain mention he wore a kilt...

**vespa** · 7th March 08, 10:11 PM

Originally Posted by MacMillan of Rathdown

Mark,
I think ElectricScotland may have blown a fuse... the Patrick they mention (born in 372AD) would have been 122 years old when the historical St. Patrick died in 492. That's remarkably old, even by today's standards. Had the historical St. Patrick lived that long it would not have escaped mention in the Irish Annals.

It is likely that the contributor to ElectricScotland has confused the birth date of Palladius, also called Patrick, First Bishop of Ireland (who died according to the Annals in 461 at the ripe old age of 89) with the younger Romano-Britain Patrick who succeeded Palladius in his ministry and died (according to the Annals) in 492.

The time-line works like this (based on the Annals):

Palladius/Patrick arrives in Ireland in 432;
Patrick the Britain arrives in Ireland in 457;
Palladius/Patrick dies in Ireland in 461;
Patrick the Britain dies in Ireland in 492

Because Patrick the Britain was at least 22 years old when he arrived in Ireland (he was sixteen when sold into slavery and spent six years in Ireland before escaping) he would have been born no later than 435.

And where was Patrick the Britain from? According to the man himself he was from Bannevem Taburniae; his grandfather, Potitus, was a priest and Patrick the Britain's father, Calpornius, was a deacon and decurio (a member of the municipal council).

Nowhere in his CONFESSION does Patrick the Britain mention he wore a kilt...

Wow!, thanx for your research and the info.

slainte

Mark