Michael Collins

[BoldHighlander]

Sounds interesting so I ordered The Wind That Shakes The Barley. I trust it is a honest look at that particular period of time and not just anti-English claptrap. Afterall my wife blamed me for what happen to Mel Gibson in that one particular movie.

It doesn't paint a pretty picture of the Brits Grant, but also as Beloitpiper said it also shows the tension within the Irish population itself pretty well.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

Sounds interesting so I ordered The Wind That Shakes The Barley. I trust it is a honest look at that particular period of time and not just anti-English claptrap.

It will probably take another twenty years or so before Ireland can deal, honestly, with the totality of its history. There has been a hugely successful (in monetary terms) political industry in Ireland that has benefited mainly from a gross-misrepresentation of the history of the country.

As the younger generations of Irish begin to see themselves in the context of being European (as opposed to the extremely parochial view taken by the State between 1922 and 1977) a more frank and honest appreciation of their history will develop.

Until then, we have to remember what Dr. Goebbels said about the cinema: "It is the most powerful weapon in the arsenal of propaganda."

[macwilkin]

If you want to know, INMHO, what the best historical Irish movie is, it would have to be Brylcreem Boys, about the "Emergency" (WWII) and how Allied and German airmen and sailors were interred by the Free State. Overall, it was very well done, especially the Irish Army uniforms and getting the mood of Ireland downpat -- "Who are we neutral against?" :mrgreen:

http://www.whiterabbitdesigncompany....brylcreem.html

If you can find it, it's worth renting.

T.

[ccga3359]

It doesn't paint a pretty picture of the Brits Grant, but also as Beloitpiper said it also shows the tension within the Irish population itself pretty well.

Nor do I paint a pretty picture of us British or any other combatant that spilt innocent blood in that era. This movie may be a piece of fiction but the words spoken can enlighten me in that particular mindset. As MacMillan of Rathdown qoted Geobbels, so true, although I hardly doubt in my instance I'll be dropping everything and join the 'Rebel' cause. I was still young when i left England in '76 but I still remember the IRA bombings down the road in London. I also remember my parents telling me about the small Irish lad shot by British soldiers when he was playing with a toy gun. I do not know if this was true or a warning as I, an 8 year old, was unwraping my plastic M16 machine gun at the time. I'm also very encouraged by the recent development in Ireland with the Belfast Aggreement. According to Wikipedia, 71% or Northern Ireland & 94% of Ireland in approval (turnout - 81% & 56% respectively).

I decided a long time ago not to continue battles of my father or forefathers, to not inherit their prejudices. I also decided to leave English politics in England. As I've said before on this forum, I'm proud to be British, I still carry dual citizenship but I'm Canadian now and that's what's important.

There have been many instances both here and in the US that Anglo/irish conflicts have resurfaced. What with the "Black" Donnellys here and of the Fenian raids of 1866, 1867, 1870 and 1871. My father's ship was torpedoed in the Pacific in 1943 and made it to Boston for repairs for a year. He'd relate how there was always fights between the Boston Irish and Royal Navy including the one annecdote of how an RN officer came back to the ship all banged after being out alone, pointed at the first few sailors he saw ordering them to follow and went back out to even the score. By that time we were officially allies. He relays it with a chuckle but when I really think about it, I do have to wonder why people have to continue the hatred, dislike, distrust.

On the other side of the coin, being Coast Guard Auxiliary and spending time on the English coast I'm also aware of the Royal National lifeboat Institution (RNLI) that is manned by fellow volunteers all over the United kingdom and the Republic of Ireland. They're an institution, almost 200 years of service and funded by public donations. Yet of the dozens of lifesaving stations in IR they are still named Royal National Lifeboat Institution and still the epitomy of cooperation between the two nations. That is why I have hope and perhaps why I've always had. Now I'm just looking for the understanding, even if my own people look bad.

[ccga3359]

If you want to know, INMHO, what the best historical Irish movie is, it would have to be Brylcreem Boys, about the "Emergency" (WWII) and how Allied and German airmen and sailors were interred by the Free State. Overall, it was very well done, especially the Irish Army uniforms and getting the mood of Ireland downpat -- "Who are we neutral against?" :mrgreen:

http://www.whiterabbitdesigncompany....brylcreem.html

If you can find it, it's worth renting.

T.

Thanks Todd, put a bid on a copy on ebay. Will do a review if I get it. IMDB lists it as a comedy and Riverdance's Jean Butler is in it, win-win . I'm sure this'll make the rounds of SOKS.

[macwilkin]

Thanks Todd, put a bid on a copy on ebay. Will do a review if I get it. IMDB lists it as a comedy and Riverdance's Jean Butler is in it, win-win . I'm sure this'll make the rounds of SOKS.

I think you'll enjoy it, Grant. I would classify it more as a drama with some funny bits thrown in, but overall, it's worth the price of admission.

T.

[Bob C]

Thanks Todd, put a bid on a copy on ebay. Will do a review if I get it. IMDB lists it as a comedy and Riverdance's Jean Butler is in it, win-win . I'm sure this'll make the rounds of SOKS.

Did someone say Jean Butler?

[Finn]

Jean Butler acts now? Hubba hubba!

[ccga3359]

Well I've now watched both "the wind that shakes the barley" and "The Brylcreme boys".

The former certainly shows both the brutality of The British and of the Unionists (as I was warned and expected). It also displays the division of the Irish free state at the time. It shows the opposite view of the film Micheal Collins but in the same time frame. For this alone I'd recommend that they both be viewed.

Brylcreme Boys depicts the lesser Anglo-Irish animosity during the Second World War although still the underlying resentment of 20 years prior is still there. My father was in the RN in WWII and when docked in Northern Ireland would regularly take a bus trip across the border for a regular booze up albeit in civilian clothes yet well known by the locals to be British service. The movie has it's lighter moments and although Jean Butler was probably cast for her dancing instead of acting as a fan I'm glad to have the movie in my collection. A thank you to Todd for recommending it.

It's fortunate that I have both movies in my collection. I will be revisiting both again.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

For the record, 35,000 Irish men from the Republic enlisted in the British armed forces and served honourably and without rancor during the Second World War. More seems to be made of "animosity" between Ireland and Britain overseas than at home in Ireland.