The Saffron Kilt

[The Kilted Reverend]

So I have a question, is Saffron close to say the duck brown on a carhart coat. All the pics I have see it looks close.

[RedBeard]

[RedBeard]

http://www.flickr.com/photos/25890248@N04/2432111526/

[Ryan Ross]

What's considered "saffron", come to kilts, is nothing like the color of the old "saffron shirt".

Do any of you folks have any idea how that came to be?


...as far as women wearing saffron, I say they should go for it.

[Ozman1944]

The pic doesn't quite capture the colour, which is warmer & richer.

[beloitpiper]

theres guys wear them and the girls look fantastic


http://www.dlscouts.ie/dlspipeband.html

I noticed that they don't always wear sporrans, which is the same way the kilts in "The Quiet Man" are worn too. Must be an Irish think. Me, I love my sporrans.

[PiobBear]

What's considered "saffron", come to kilts, is nothing like the color of the old "saffron shirt".

While I've no idea how the saffron color of the leine and the kilt compare, I do believe that it's a sure bet that it refers to the color, not the spice. Saffron is the dried stamens of the crocus flower; it's highly unlikely that there ever were enough crocuses blooming in Ireland for the entire nation to use it as a dyestuff when very, very few could even afford to use it as a spice.

Do any of you folks have any idea how that came to be?

In 1900 Seamas OCeallaigh of the Gaelic League asked Pádraig Pearse about developing an Irish national dress, perhaps based upon a pair of trews which had been found at Killery, County Sligo dated from about the 16th century in the Royal Irish Academy Collection in the National Museum in Dublin.

On October 26 Pearse wrote:
"...one would at first sight take them for a rather clumsily made and ill-treated pair of modern gentlemen's drawers. Frankly, I should much prefer to see you arrayed in a kilt, although it may be less authentic, than in a pair of these trews. You would if you appeared in the latter, run the risk of leading the spectators to imagine that you had forgotten to don your trousers and had sallied forth in your drawers."

The ancient dress of Ireland was the leine and brat, somewhat resembling a woman's chemise and a horse blanket. As a modern form of national dress, it suffers from the same limitations as the trews in the National Museum. As the Irish leine was traditionally dyed the color of saffron (the wearing of which had been banned by the English under Henry VIII in 1537), the color saffron was chosen as the color if the Irish kilt.

[Morris at Heathfield]

The color of the modern saffron kilt is probably much darker than the historical Irish léine. There's an article here in which the author dyed a linen garment with real saffron. It turned out a pale yellow color. Whether the Irish used actual saffron to dye the léine is debatable, as there are other dyes that can produce much the same color as saffron, at a considerably lower expense.

I realize these links are all from the same source, but Kass McGann seems to me to be as knowledgeable on the subject of historical Irish dress as Matt Newsome is on the subject of the history of the kilt. And she emphatically rejects the notion that the kilt was a traditional form of Irish dress. She also gives what I think is a very convincing argument against the existence of clan tartans before the Proscription.

[Daibhidh O'Baoighill]

[QUOTE=Morris of Heathfield;542481]The color of the modern saffron kilt is probably much darker than the historical Irish léine. There's an article here in which the author dyed a linen garment with real saffron. It turned out a pale yellow color. Whether the Irish used actual saffron to dye the léine is debatable, as there are other dyes that can produce much the same color as saffron, at a considerably lower expense.

Great links! It make sense that they would have used available/affordable dyes and not expensive saffron.

Cheers!
David

[KeithM]

Would you hazard a guess as to the color of the kilt in the following description?

He himself, in variegated array, advances with lofty mein. Thó garter ribbons hanging at his leg were dyed with Corycian saffron, and with the tint of the Syrian shell, as was his plaid. His sister had embroidered his tunic with the red gold, and a double line of purple went round his terrible shoulders.


I am wondering if the original clan MacMartin wore saffron (as a base) and used a type of red dye, or purple to offset the base color.