Kilts and Austria

[MartinGrenoble]

Whatever history may tell us, we should be glad there is someone' out there promoting kilts actively and giving more men an excuse to de-bifurcate.
Actually, Retti's web site is quite tongue-in-cheek about the origins of the Carinthian kilt, but they appear to have been successful in selling the idea, and kilted highland games take place every year in Austria (as also in Germany, Switzerland, Holland).

It's a fine-looking tartan they have developed, vey expensive of course. At least they chose good wool for their kilts, not the cheap synthetics that are sold in Scotland & USA.

Martin

[rinfrance]

You mention cheap synthetics, well I wear a kilt all the time, (more or less) and a "cheap" synthetic wears better than wool, cleans better than wool and is certainly more practical in a reasonable climate. I have a lightweight synth for when its really warm, say in the 30's and that is OK just imagine a "proper" wool kilt.
To get accepted as everyday wear then the garment has to be cheap and reliable enough for that purpose.
I am for one not after looking like a vintage scotsman, but a modernistic person who happens to wear a kilt.
I really do not think that you actually wear an original kilt either, but a substandard wool made and altered by way of so called improvments. Tell me I gather your colours are course faded ones, the wool thick, waterproof and scratchy, no of course not so yours is no different to mine, a facsimile of the original.

[MartinGrenoble]

... a "cheap" synthetic wears better than wool, cleans better than wool ...
I really do not think that you actually wear an original kilt either,...

What a strange -- and rather aggressive -- reply !

I have kilts of all kinds, most of them made in Scotland, and have no hesitation in saying that good worsted wool is by far the most comfortable and attractive. Sheep don't mind the rain, and my kilts don't mind being washed.

In very hot weather (pretty rare in France, it seems), I wear cotton.

And I wear my kilts as everyday garments, not as a fancy costume. My origins are quite incidental compared with the comfort of being unbifurcated.

Martin

[Jack Daw]

Tartan here, tartan there - what's important is the CELTS!!!

[Morris at Heathfield]

Unfortunately, the article is very economical with details about the archaeological finds. What were these Austrian (La Tène culture?) kilts like? Were they four yards or eight yards? Were they made of 11-ounce, 13-ounce, 16-ounce, 18-ounce, or 22-ounce material? Wool, acrylic, or poly-viscose? Were they box-pleated, knife-pleated, military box-pleated, barrel-pleated, or simply gathered into folds and belted on? Were they pleated to the sett, to the stripe, or to nothing in particular? Did they have three straps, two straps, pins, ribbons, or buttons? Did they have linings, waist bands, and/or drawstrings? Did they have kilt pins on the outer apron? Sword or safety pin? I'm sure others can think of more questions, but you get the idea.

[Ayin McFye]

ok austria really has little else to brag about

Isn't Austria where Arnold Schwarzenegger is from? Not that I'd brag about that, but at least it's something.

[beloitpiper]

The comments on that page under the article remind me of how much work we have o do about educating the public about kilts...

[MacDhunadh]

Hi there!

Forget this Rettl (hi)story. I know Thomas Rettl since 2003 and all they have found in Molzbichl is a small scrap of tartan, which doesn't mean, that the Celts of Carithia did wear the kilt. That's only Rettl's story or should i say believe? 2003 Rettl didn't know, how a belted plaid was really looking, he didn't know how much fabric he needs for it. But 2004 he started to order the fabric of his carinthian celtic ancient tartan to sell it as belted plaids and kilts. You can see some videos and pictures of the Rettl fashion show in New York, some years ago, Sir Sean Connery was one of the special guests. But if you look at the pictures, you can see, that the male model isn't able to wear the belted plaid the right way and today, they also don't know how to pleat and fold it, to get a true belted plaid.

http://www.bavarianhighlands.de/kiltundfashion.html

And here you can see the ancient Celtic tartan ( this scrap found in Molzbichl )

http://www.kiltsociety.at/bilder/Sta.../Images/15.jpg

Rettl is no bad guy, but a good businessman, his latest story is this one, that the ancient bavarians did wear the kilt and not the leatherpant so he made a bavarian tartan too.

Don't take it to serious. The Rettl tartans are a very good fabric, but he isn't much less expensive as if you buy your kilt from a scottish kiltmaker. My first kilt was a Rettl Kilt but the Styrian tartan. I knew, that this one couldn't be the last one, so i started to make it myself. Today i don't know anymore, how much kilts i really have, but never mind

Greets from Austria,

MacDhunadh

[Morris at Heathfield]

While searching for information on early tartans, I recently came across some messages by an Austrian archaeologist which lay the blame squarely on the Discovery Channel and Ananova.com for taking the Austrian invention of the kilt idea as a serious fact. After reading MartinGrenoble's and MacDhunadh's posts, I wondered if it might be a case of humor failing to translate (and nobody bothering to do any fact-checking).

[M. A. C. Newsome]

This again? This is ridiculous. Some here are saying, "oh well, at least he is promoting kilt wearing." But do we really want kilt wearing promoted with bald faced lies and false history designed simply for commercial purposes?

There is nothing wrong with taking tartan designs from archaeological finds in Austria and re-making them as modern district tartand and even making kilts from them. But inventing a patently false history of the garment, about which there is already enough misinformation and confusion circulating about, is just wrong.