joining the clan

[gilmore]

Is there a thought here, by Gilmore, that the nature of Scottish clans can not have evolved from their old ways as the world has changed? In other words, the clans must be exactly the same as they were two or three hundred years ago or they do not exist.
I think both the word and the subject "clan" have changed over time as has the world.

The voice of Gilmore in my head may now smash my argument.

Sure, Scottish clans have evolved. They have gone from being very important, from being the way that people in the Scottish Highlands lived their lives from cradle to grave centuries ago, to being little more than an interesting historical artifact. This is not to say that fulfilling friendships can't be built around joining a clan association. They can.

[macwilkin]

Sure, Scottish clans have evolved. They have gone from being very important, from being the way that people in the Scottish Highlands lived their lives from cradle to grave centuries ago, to being little more than an interesting historical artifact. This is not to say that fulfilling friendships can't be built around joining a clan association. They can.

To add to Gil's well-stated comments: This Sunday I was participating in a memorial service honouring members of the Grand Army of the Republic, a veteran's organization for Union soldiers during the Civil War. The speaker noted that only a select few were given membership in the GAR and its Southern counterpart, the United Confederate Veterans. Both organizations eventually ceased to exist when the last member "went west" to Fiddler's Green, yet both left legacies -- The Sons of Union & Sons of Confederate Veterans, so their names and missions would live on.

The first modern-day clan society -- the Buchanan Society -- was a mutal-aid society to assist clan members who came to Glasgow to work in the factories and found themselves in trouble. In a similar vein, the many St. Andrew's and Caledonian societies that dot the globe also served as a mutual-aid society for Scots scattered the world over, as a result of famine, war and clearance.

In one way, the modern-day clan society is the successor to the clan system of old, a system which will never be again, as Gil noted -- the clan society, not only being a social organization, also can serve as a store-house of historical and genealogical information for the clans -- preserving the memory of a time gone by that will never be repeated.

Regards,

Todd

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

so then ive got a super common tartan that has no clan with it ... guess i should find a good clan join it ... and hope its not as bright a tartan

Dow is often quoted as a sept of Davidson, which has a chief: Alexander Davidson of Davidson, who lives in New Zealand. If you feel it important to identify with a Chief as much as his clan, then I suppose you should join the Clan Davidson Society.

Oh yes. The Davidson tartan is quite handsome, and not nearly as bright as Buchanan.

[Downix]

Dow is often quoted as a sept of Davidson, which has a chief: Alexander Davidson of Davidson, who lives in New Zealand. If you feel it important to identify with a Chief as much as his clan, then I suppose you should join the Clan Davidson Society.

Oh yes. The Davidson tartan is quite handsome, and not nearly as bright as Buchanan.

always wondered if there was a relationship between Dow and Downes/Downs... (and Downes itself is a hard one to nail down, being claimed as English, despite it being majority in Wales and Ireland...)

[Bugbear]

Sure, Scottish clans have evolved. They have gone from being very important, from being the way that people in the Scottish Highlands lived their lives from cradle to grave centuries ago, to being little more than an interesting historical artifact. This is not to say that fulfilling friendships can't be built around joining a clan association. They can.

Sometimes a concept or idea of something can be stronger and longer lasting than it's physical existance. Thank you for clarifying, Gilmore.

[Matty Ross]

I joined the Ross Clan Society of America several years back. I maintained membership for some time. Things got a little tight financially and I let my membership lapse. I recently looked into joining again. So now I ask myself what does $25.00 a year get me that I don't already have? A newsletter and a name tag to wear at the Highland games. I spent my money on a new Thrifty kilt instead. I am Matty Ross of the Clan ROSS. I am just not a member of the local society anymore.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

There is an argument to be made that "clanship" can only be achieved or claimed if one is recognized as a member of the clan by the chief (who has the absolute authority to decide who is, and who is not, a member of his clan), a point that appears to be well supported by Adams, Innes of Learney, and Way of Plean. If one chooses not be a member of their clan society, by which means the chief of that clan recognizes his clanfolk, how can one be a member of the Clan? It would seem to me that without chiefly recognition, even by as circuitous a route as through membership in a clan society, one would be, at best, a stranger to the clan-- albeit a stranger with a similar name.

[dowofbuchanan]

well now my turn to ring in on this again and clarify ... family history goes back to 1450 something at my grandmas house not davidson for sure (damn good too as they were loyal to the british huns) buchanan is my family clan ... however the buchanan society only allows membership to the 5-6 major heads not the lowly septs such as my own ill wear any tartan that suits me but id like to be able to say im a member of clan ....... and mean it for myself rather than just long buried ancestors

[Keys MacQuarrie]

Hmmm. Clan MacQuarrie can trace it's roots all the way back to King Alpin with the first recorded clan chief dying in, I believe, 833 and is a VERY old and respected clan. The sad truth is that the last chief died in the early 1800's without any issue, but truth be told, as long as I'm alive, and able to trace my lineage back to King Alpin, Clan MacQuarrie remains a clan.

[O'Callaghan]

Heralds were originally blowers of trumpets and recorders of battle honours, for which they had to be able to recognise the combatants by their livery. From that they grew to be authorities and eventually arbiters of what we now call heraldry. However, it has come to a sad point if a herald can tell you whether you exist.

For the record, 'The O'Callaghan' at the time was recognised by the Irish Record Office before they ceased to carry out that function, and he still has a living direct descendant who claims the title, albeit a Spanish citizen. However, as far as I can tell, the Callaghan clan society appears to be defunct, as they are not reachable at the last known address.

So, we have a chief but no society. I certainly don't believe that there has to be a society to tell the chief who is a member of the clan, as there were no societies when the clans had any real power, and that goes the same for the Scots.

I agree with the point of view that a clan abides as long as one descendant draws breath. If there is even one left then there is always someone who could claim the title of chief, and a herald would be presumptious to say anything more than whether they are entitled to a particular coat of arms.