Sgian Dubhs are not weapons ... It's official!

[Zardoz]

As regards this topic, I notice that the Regulations quoted seem to indicate that only Officers and W.O.'s(?) are to wear siagns dubh. Am I reading that correctly? If so, why?

Looks like only 'gentlemen' are allowed to have one.

[Woodsheal]

From James D. Forman, The Scottish Dirk, Historical Arms Series No. 26, 1991:

[HarborSpringsPiper]

Thanks for posting that scan, Brian. I've been thinking of wearing a wood-handled handcrafted short blade knife I have as a daywear sgian, instead of the dressier black handled one with a cairngorm in the pommel that I have always worn. That reference certainly substantiates the plainer nature of the early examples.

I think I'll commission my good buddy to make me one with either an antler or bone handle.

[Galician]

Looks like only 'gentlemen' are allowed to have one.

So much for their "utilitarian" use, then!

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

From James D. Forman, The Scottish Dirk, Historical Arms Series No. 26, 1991:

This is the sort of scholarship that really should put the nail in the coffin-load of myths surrounding the sgian dubh. James Forman's monograph on The Scottish Dirk is excellent, and places the dirk (and sgian dubh) in a highly readable social and historical context. If you have any interest in the subject (or even if you don't, but have an interest in the culture and history of Scotland) you really should read this book.

For those who continue to argue that "just because there is no proof that the sgian dubh wasn't a weapon doesn't mean that it wasn't" I can only say, you are welcome to that opinion. And, while you are at it, you are also welcome to believe that William Wallace painted his face blue and wore a kilt. Never mind that there is no historical foundation for the argument. If it makes you feel good...

What we do know for certain is that the Highland dirk was not outlawed in the proscription Acts of 1718, 1726, and 1747. Since the dirk was not outlawed and could be worn openly (and we have ample written and pictorial evidence to show that this is true), there would have been no need to carry a wee knife concealed about one's person. The authorities were concerned with removing guns, swords, targes, pikes and axes-- in other words military arms-- from the Highlanders, not the everyday tools of the typical Highland household.

[Zardoz]

So much for their "utilitarian" use, then!

Yeah, in those regs they are a decorative item, like flashes or rosettes.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

As regards this topic, I notice that the Regulations quoted seem to indicate that only Officers and W.O.'s(?) are to wear siagns dubh. Am I reading that correctly? If so, why?

Because soldiers loose things, and the government is loathe to have to continually replace "issue" items. Officers and Warrant Officers are required to purchase much of their uniform kit, and this would presumably include their "regimental" sgian dubh.

Bandsmen also wear sgians dubh, and these are issued as part of the bandsman's uniform, and only worn when performing.

[macwilkin]

Because soldiers loose things, and the government is loathe to have to continually replace "issue" items. Officers and Warrant Officers are required to purchase much of their uniform kit, and this would presumably include their "regimental" sgian dubh.

Bandsmen also wear sgians dubh, and these are issued as part of the bandsman's uniform, and only worn when performing.

I would tend to agree with Rathdown; remember that someone has to pay for all of those sgains issued to other ranks. Rather than the MoD paying for sgains for rankers, shouldn't that money go towards "real" weaponry such as rifles and other kit?

T.

[Stratherrick]

That monograph seals it for me, along with the finer detail on the info in the Proscription Act.

So, a sgian dubh is a development of a gralloching knife.

Slainte

Bruce

[Dall_Piobaire]

An interesting variety of theories about sgians dubh and now here is mine. Victorian gentlemen liked to dress up in Highland dress and scoured their castles and stately homes for any sort of weaponry to accessorise with. It was even laid down in instructions from the Lord Chamberlain when attending levees that acceptable dress included, and I quote -
"Highland basket hilted sword, black leather (or metal mounted) Scabbard .....Dress Dirk.........Dress Sgiandubh worn in hose" with the footnote "Highland pistols and Powder Horn may be worn".
All this just to go to a dance party. With the coming of more enlightened times most of this weaponry has returned to its rightful place - hanging on the wall - apart from the sgian dubh which remains as the sole survivor of all of this Victorian "bling". No doubt Scots of yesteryear possessed knives for their daily use and they may well have stuck them down the top of their hose (for the lack of any pockets) but I am sure that the tradition we follow today has more to do with the Lord Chamberlain and his ilk than any other romantic notions.

With this I agree completely! My references were never meant to apply to the present day Sgain Dubh or it's use or purpose. My references were meant to apply to what it had evolved from, and in this case it seems to have been the Sgain Achlais(sp)