Beautiful Doublet

[JSFMACLJR]

My "eye" in matters of Highland Dress has been formed by 1) owning a large number of books on Highland Dress and spending quite a bit of time studying the old portraits reproduced within 2) looking at many old portraits in museums and historic places in Scotland 3) collecting a large number of vintage photos of men in Highland Dress 4) studying the dress of the kilted Highland regiments and 5) examining very closely the dress in The Highlanders of Scotland.

This is in no way any sort of definitive or exhaustive list of sources, but it is a large enough "sampling" to get a good feel for what is traditional and what is not.

I cannot recall seeing a doublet made with tashes of a different colour from the body in any old portrait. My memory isn't perfect. But if such a thing occurs in an old portrait somewhere I probably would have seen it.

We sometimes have to keep in mind that Highland Dress as it has come down to us was perpetuated in the military. Military doublets respect the origins of the collar and cuffs being originally turned back and showing a contrasting lining colour. The tashes did not originate in this way, but were always an extension of the body.
Your statement "tailors do what their clients request" explains it all. A tailor may be highly respected and very expensive, but if a client requests him to make something that's at odds with tradtion, the product will be at odds with tradition. The product doesn't gain the patina of tradition just because it's been produced.

I won't let your insulting my friend cause me too much distress! Unfortunately I cannot reveal his name, as he wishes anonymity, but you are WAY off base! An excellent tailor wouldn't make anything that is out of line. Really. You have left out one important group in your study of Highland dress, and that is the vast number of gentlemen who grew up wearing it. Have you lived and moved among the Highland gentry? Have you attended any of the great Highland balls? I can assure you, in no uncertain terms, that the doublet in question is perfectly normal, acceptable, and traditional.

When you wrote "It's easy to see how someone not familiar with such things might, by false analogy, think of the cuffs, collar, and tashes all as added bits simply stuck onto the body of the doublet, and all equally subject to being done in contrasting colours", you really show your ignorance. Contrasting colours are as old as the garments themselves.

I'll say no more on the matter, except experience matters a great deal here. The gentlemen who wore/wear evening dress regularly saw it through different eyes than you do. They lived the life, and the old traditions of Highland dress are epitomised in what they wore, and in what they continue to wear.

[JSFMACLJR]

I have no objection to the two-color tashes, but the collar strikes me as unusual. I do not remember any other military-styled collar with lapels. I'd like to see it on, to see how it stands up...

The one fact that people are forgetting is that this is NOT a military doublet. Yes, it is a doublet with "military features," but nonetheless it is purely civil.

I have no photo of the doublet being worn, but I have several pics of doublets with lapels and stand up collars. I, in fact, have such a doublet:

[MacLowlife]

thanks

[jordanjm]

I think it is a beautiful doublet. I wish I could afford one.

[Phil]

When you wrote "It's easy to see how someone not familiar with such things might, by false analogy, think of the cuffs, collar, and tashes all as added bits simply stuck onto the body of the doublet, and all equally subject to being done in contrasting colours", you really show your ignorance. Contrasting colours are as old as the garments themselves.

I would agree. I have seen no less a personage than Prince Charles, Duke of Rothesay sporting a dinner jacket/tuxedo with contrasting red lapels - an affectation begun by one of his forebears I believe -

[Jock Scot]

There has been some discussion of late about styles of evening doublets. One of the nicest doublets I have seen belongs to a good friend of mine, from Appin. I am posting these pictures to show that one does not have to go the "cookie cutter route"! It is most unlikely that you will see too many doublets like this one. I am especially taken by the silk tartan lining. Enjoy

I rather fancy that I have seen that doublet for real! Sadly these days, we are getting buried in the "peas in a pod" look of the Quartermaster's Store. What the modern kilt wearer does not realise is that the personal flair of the owner and the individual skill of a tailor can produce a variation on the same theme and in|Scotland is quite normal. In my time on this earth we seem to have sunk to the standard issue PC of the hire companies, which is understandable in some ways ,but if some one was going to spend £X on buying a PC, then with a few pounds more an individual style can be created that is more than fitting to an occasion------in fact, in my not so humble opinion, desirable!

[OC Richard]

To me "traditional" usually implies things which first appear at some point of time in the past, and can subsequently be traced through the years in a series occurances, implying an unbroken lineage.

Now it's an interesting topic, discovering the origin and earliest appearances of the "tashes" to create the classic "doublet" style.

As I recall the earliest images I've seen show the entire doublet made from the same fabric, sometimes tartan, sometimes a plain colour.

They were worn in the military by the pipers of the 93rd Highlanders before they were adopted generally by the Scottish kilted regiments, who at that time were still wearing coatees:





Then in 1855 doublets were adopted by the kilted Highland regiments (this is the early version. Gauntlet cuffs came later)



In the classic 19th century military doublet note that the epaulettes were likewise the same colour as the body, as their origin, as well as that of the tashes, was not as turned-back elements:



In any case I don't go around inventing stuff, but rather have the approach of a historian, looking at as much evidence as I can and drawing the most logical conclusions I can.

If someone can lay out a case, supported by images, of the tashes being a contrasting colour, going back to early appearances of the doublet style and persisting in an unbroken tradition down to modern times, I'd love to see it.

This topic reminds me of when people seperate the two flashes on their garter, putting one on the outside of their leg and one on the inside. It shows both an ingorance of how they have traditionally been worn, and an ignorance of how they came about.

[Jock Scot]

AAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHH! Not THAT infamous picture of Sir Shaun(MY spelling).

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

OC Richard has raised an interesting point, but I think there is a difference, actually a big difference, between military uniforms and civilian attire. Without getting into the "chicken or egg" argument about which influenced what, I think we would both agree that civilian attire has far more latitude than military uniforming. Soldiers wear what they are issued and, because armies are notoriously stingy, changes in the style of their uniforms usually occurs only rarely-- in the instance of Highland regiments, perhaps only two or three times in a century and even then the changes are hardly drastic.

Civilian attire, on the other hand, really is subject to the whim of the wearer. While I think we can generally agree that Highland evening attire tends to be "somewhat" conservative, I think we also have to admit that it lends itself to a fair degree of dandyism-- coats and waistcoats of tartan cut on the bias, that sort of thing. Certainly in my lifetime I've seen doublets made in subtly different colours-- a rifle green coatee with black silk cuffs, and a navy blue velvet Argyll with deep burgundy trim, to recall two, non tartan, examples. Both were, in my opinion, fine examples of classic Highland attire.

I think a difficulty does arise when the words "traditional" and "classic" are used interchangeably. As I have stated on other threads, I prefer to use the term "classic" for those items of civilian Highland apparel which have evolved in terms of aesthetics and function between 1839 and 1939. "Style" is a word I would prefer to use to describe how an individual chooses to dress.

So then, what is "traditional"? Again, for clarity of communication, I prefer to use the word "traditional" to describe a time-- or event-- when certain items of civilian Highland attire are usually worn. I am the first to admit that my definitions are arbitrary, and far from perfect. But I also think that they provide a reasonable frame of reference when discussing clothing, as opposed to talking about antique automobiles or military customs.

Now I know some of you would like to see more instances of the flaps on the tashes being of a contrasting colour, before you are willing to accept it as a long standing practice; but I doubt you will find many (if any) examples if you limit your search to strictly military apparel. Cast your net wider and I think you will find civilian examples, although I doubt there will be too many, as style is very much an individualistic thing-- what one may consider "stylish" others might find to be outlandish, even if the garment is as classic as the ubiquitous Prince Charlie coatee or the standard doublet.

[Jock Scot]

If you are looking for military influences to highland attire then look no further than the Mess jackets of the regiments of the British Army. Collars, cuffs and lapels are very often different colours and the "bum freezer" look is little different to some Highland attire styles. I know we are in the "chicken and egg" situation, but some one with a tad of imagination combined with an imaginative tailor could soon come up with a civilian variation on the theme. I know, because that is what I did!