contemporary dressy/formal

[JSFMACLJR]

I did not mean to be insulting; ...The kilt, itself, is a timeless classic, but that can not be said for the other clothing worn with it. For example, I agree that a velvet doublet with jabot of quality lace would look very nice, but is it practical today? How many members of this forum would ever have an opportunity to wear a velvet doublet? In most situations, today, a velvet doublet would be very out of place."

You might be insulting, I'm not yet sure.

I find a velvet doublet to be quite practical ( yes, I have several ), whatever practical might mean. It looks extremely sharp; it is elegant; it is very traditional ( black broadcloth, barathea etc, is rather a foreign fabric for traditional Highland dress...too English and too "presbyterian" ); it feels warm in winter and in cool climes ( Scotland? ). If it needs cleaning, there is a wonderful modern convenience called a dry cleaner, which can clean it well ( I try rarely to patronize these establishments ).

So, in what situation would my velvet doublets be out of place? Balls? Dances? Family gatherings?. These are some of the events to which I wear Highland evening dress. Am I out of place? Be very careful how you answer that one!

[JSFMACLJR]

I do agree that formality is fast disappearing. Last time I even saw black tie in use was 1967. If I wear a tie or a jacket to work, people make comments (and I work in a Fortune 100). Doesn't mean that we can't push back on that, but I might find MacMillan's breakdown a bit unrealistic in everyday society. Perhaps he lives a different life from me.

Perhaps a great number of people live different lives from you, for I go to all sorts of black tie events every year...and I'm certainly not wealthy! I guess it all depends upon where you live, your interests, your upbringing, and your friends. Here in Louisville, I can assure you black tie is worn by quite a few people to parties. Really.

Many of my set love to make an event "special" by dressing for dinner parties. Why? Because it is a nice thing for genteel people to do, it honours the host and hostess, and everyone looks sharp in a dinner jacket (or Highland dress ). Might I suggest you try it? Have a dinner party , and insist everybody dresses. You'll be surprised how much fun the evening will be!

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

I do agree that formality is fast disappearing. Last time I even saw black tie in use was 1967. If I wear a tie or a jacket to work, people make comments (and I work in a Fortune 100). Doesn't mean that we can't push back on that, but I might find MacMillan's breakdown a bit unrealistic in everyday society. Perhaps he lives a different life from me.

Maybe people just dress up more in Virginia? Simply because one does not have regular occasion to dress in a more formal manner doesn't mean that they shouldn't know that's expected when they are called upon to dress up.

I will admit that (unfortunately) most North Americans don't have (or create) the opportunity to dress up. When my wife and I lived in Europe we received, on average, invitations to three black tie events every month. We also attended five or six white tie events every year. Were these snobbish affairs? Well, if you think something like the local Gaelic Athletic Association dinner is snobbish, then I suppose so.

The big difference between here and Europe is that most Europeans like to dress up occasionally, and enjoy climbing into a "monkey suit" and taking their date to something nicer than the mosh pit at the local disco or club. It has nothing to do with with "social status"-- whatever that is-- and everything to do with taking pride in "puttin' on the Ritz" and enjoying a night out on the tiles.

Years ago, in Los Angeles, I belonged to a dinner club that met once a month, always in a different member's home-- and always in black tie. What started as four couples ended up with about 30 of us... just having (well-dressed) fun.

[Ancienne Alliance]

The men in the photographs at the beginning of this post, are all young. Like it or not, they don't want to look like their grand-daddies or dress in costumes, a la the Highland Gentlemen. I think it is encouraging that dressier kilt accessories that appeal to a younger market are even being designed. Classic styles change with each generation; the width of ties, lapels, pant legs, the number of buttons on a jacket all change, but the classic look usually remains. I wouldn't wear my grandfather's tux, and I wouldn't expect a twenty-something to wear a traditional PC to nightclub.

Yes, I think I got your point.
I must humbly admit that I have done much worse than wearing a ruche tie. I simply threw away my father's kilt... an ugly story really...
So all I can say, is that if my grand son wants to wear a black shirt with a rainbow ruche tie...
well... ... as long as his kilt doesn't go beneath his knee cap.... I will be mighty proud of him.


Best,

Robert

[Ancienne Alliance]

I have even been designing tartans like a fiend at Scotweb in hopes of someday being able to afford a kilt with my own tartan. Of course, now I have a couple hundred or so to choose from. But I digress....

... It has also been noted that when so attired H.R.H.'s jackets have none of the details ordinarily associated with "traditional" highland dress. Not even a brass button or a shoulder cord. ...

... Here is a gentleman who could, perhaps lead us in a new direction of dress without a slavish attachment to tradition. tradition is wonderful, but it should serve the present rather than enslaving us.

...Even when dressing formally a gentleman should try for a casual insouciance that tells the world that he is comfortable and that he has done this before. It's alright by me to try new things and stray away from the traditional, but there's no law that says you have to look like a jackass when you do it.

Dear sir,

You do not digress in any way (or so little...) and we, here at X Marks the Scot, would be most pleased if you could show us your tartans designs (hundreds you say... whoo !... be steady, my heart )

For the rest, I find your conclusions quite befitting and congratulate you.


Best,

Robert

[davidlpope]

I must humbly admit that I have done much worse than wearing a ruche tie. I simply threw away my father's kilt...

As Pope, (well, as a Pope...) I assign as your penance the task of procuring for yourself five more kilts, in a wondrous array of tartans and tweeds, as well as a goodly measure of kilt hose, bonnets, sporrans, and bias-cut tartan waistcoats!! Go and sin no more.

David (Pope)

[Ancienne Alliance]

As Pope, (well, as a Pope...) I assign as your penance the task of procuring for yourself five more kilts, in a wondrous array of tartans and tweeds, as well as a goodly measure of kilt hose, bonnets, sporrans, and bias-cut tartan waistcoats!! Go and sin no more

David (Pope)

Hey ! I'll let YOU deal with Lady C....

(mind you, i love this kind of penance...)


Best,

Robert

[Mael Coluim]

It doesn't seem all that long ago that the term casual for a male's attire would mean sport coat and tie. But then again perhaps it was " A Long Time Ago In A Galaxy Far Far Away -"

[Ancienne Alliance]

I disagree that black shirts shouldn't be worn with the kilt. Nearly all the shirts I wear with my kilt are black. Of course, I don't own a jacket. Black jacket, black shirt may be too much.

Who says black shirts shouldn't be worn ?




Best,

Robert

[Ancienne Alliance]

The big difference between here and Europe is that most Europeans like to dress up occasionally...

... It has nothing to do with with "social status"-- whatever that is-- and everything to do with taking pride in "puttin' on the Ritz" and enjoying a night out on the tiles.

... just having (well-dressed) fun.

I guess "fun" is the key word.


Best,

Robert