What my Mom says about belt loops on kilts

**McMurdo** · 16th February 10, 04:52 AM

Belt loops at one time, and not so long ago mind you, were actually sporran straps. My first kilt was my dad's it was made in Scotland by A&J Scott and co. circa 1950 a belt would not go through the loops as they were put there for the sporran strap. Perhaps some makers did some things differently but my experience is that the loops on a kilt were for the sporran not a belt.

**The Guy in the Kilt at UC** · 16th February 10, 04:55 AM

Originally Posted by OC Richard

I wonder if it was made that way out of ignorance, or because US clients were asking for them to be that way.

Why can't it be both?

**Abax** · 16th February 10, 11:59 PM

I just saw about 50 kilties go through the Edinburgh airport this weekend (they were going to the Scotland- Wales game, I presume), and about half of them had that wierd twin distortion of pleats below the belt loops. Through my food poisoning-induced fog, I wondered why my kilts didn't suffer the same affliction. My head's a lot clearer now, and I realize it's because I don't use the belt loops for anything.

When I ordered my (very) first kilt from Matt Newsome, I asked about belt loops and he convinced me they weren't necessary, although he patiently supplied belt loop blanks should I have felt the need to add them later. Of course he was right, they were not necessary on my now most-favored kilt. When I asked another kilt maker about not adding belt loops to an 8 yard kilt I ordered, she said she wouldn't make them without loops and that they should always be used. Hmmm . . . still not using them, not even for the sporran straps, and with great success.

Abax

**OC Richard** · 17th February 10, 01:59 AM

Originally Posted by Abax

When I asked another kilt maker about not adding belt loops to an 8 yard kilt I ordered, she said she wouldn't make them without loops and that they should always be used.

Wow... I got the opposite reaction when I ordered my last kilt (from Wanda McSwain).

I said "no belt loops, only two straps" and she brightened up, saying that she was in complete agreement.

**The Wizard of BC** · 17th February 10, 02:47 AM

Now I'm going to throw a wrench into everything that has said before this in this thread.

In the real Contemporary Style Kilts that I make I still have the stabilizer and interfacing found in a Traditional Style Kilt like Matt and Barb make.

But because my Kilts are designed to include pockets I can't put the stabilizer and interfacing behind the sewn down pleats of the Fell. It would be in the way of the pockets and defeat the whole purpose of having interfacing in the first place.

So my Kilts have a real waistband. And real Beltloops. The stabilizer and interfacing is moved up, into the waistband along with the straps and buckles.

The Beltloops can be 2" for a regular trouser belt of about 1 3/4" width, or they can be 3" to accommodate a full Kilt Belt.

You can see two of the six beltloops in this picture. Just at the edges of the outer apron.
See, you can have it both ways.

**OC Richard** · 17th February 10, 05:46 AM

About the height of old military kilts, what about THIS???

(Judging from the sporran, a Gordon Highlander.)

**Jock Scot** · 17th February 10, 05:56 AM

Originally Posted by OC Richard

About the height of old military kilts, what about THIS???

(Judging from the sporran, a Gordon Highlander.)

I have seen many, possibly hundreds of kilts being worn like that, in the 1940's and '50's. I don't recall seeing belt loops. In this picture I don't think those are belt loops, but "keepers" on the belt, but I could be wrong.

**Lallans** · 18th February 10, 07:35 AM

I always thought the belt loops WERE belt loops and that their major function was to keep my belt from hitting the ground when I loosened it and carelessly let it go, as is learned when wearing trousers. Now you guys have me terrified about distorting my tartan!

But whatever, where I live almost nobody loops their sporran straps through the things. It strikes me as too difficult, and finicky even. And as mentioned it would make the sporran practically immovable. And, in avoiding the distortion danger, putting the belt on over the loops, just ignoring them completely, seems doltish somehow. It may be time to get the tiny scissors out....

**Tobus** · 18th February 10, 10:20 AM

This whole discussion leads to the question: what good is the kilt belt doing?

If it's not meant to be worn through the belt loops, then it's not holding up the kilt. And I think most people agree that a kilt shouldn't need holding up in the first place if it's fitted/tapered properly to the natural waist and hips.

So the belt isn't supporting the kilt at all. For most people, it's not supporting a dirk or other accoutrements either. If wearing a sporran with its own belt or chain, the kilt belt is not supporting the sporran. What good is it? Decoration only?

**Macman** · 18th February 10, 10:33 AM

Originally Posted by Tobus

This whole discussion leads to the question: what good is the kilt belt doing?

If it's not meant to be worn through the belt loops, then it's not holding up the kilt. And I think most people agree that a kilt shouldn't need holding up in the first place if it's fitted/tapered properly to the natural waist and hips.

So the belt isn't supporting the kilt at all. For most people, it's not supporting a dirk or other accoutrements either. If wearing a sporran with its own belt or chain, the kilt belt is not supporting the sporran. What good is it? Decoration only?

I think the belt is for decoration only, unless, like you say, it's being worn with a dirk, and then it's a requirement. The great kilt required a belt to hold it on, but a modern well-fitted kilt doesn't require a belt. I wear a belt for decoration; I think it sets off the look of the kilt well when a waistcoat isn't being worn.

Also, I can't remember having seen sporran straps go through the loops where I'm from.