Need a kilt jacket?

[Nick Fiddes]

This thread has just been brought to my attention. I tried to PM Paul but his mailbox is full so my message won't send. And I don't know how to contact him otherwise. So here is the message I intended to send. I'd be grateful if anyone who can would bring it to his attention.

==

Hi Paul,

Someone on Xmarks brought your jacket site to my attention, where you are using our name in your marketing.

We were offered these ourselves and refused. They are most definitely NOT the same jackets as any we have ever sold on Scotweb. When we were shown them they were far from our quality standards in both materials and construction. And to say that they are Made in Scotland is factually misleading since we know they're imported from Eastern Europe.

Also, I notice the background tartan on your web site is one of our copyright images, used without our permission. I'd ask you please to remove that at the same time.

We could of course complain to Trading Standards or even take legal action. But I'd very much prefer to resolve this amicably. I'd also intend to publish a correction on XMarks and Brotherhood once the matter is resolved. But if you can remove our name and correct the factual errors in a timely fashion I shall of course do so politely.

Please confirm as soon as possible when this is done.

Thanks

Nick

[Paul]

Nick, I just cleared my inbox there - when I received an email notifying me that it was full.

I was not aware that the jackets had been offered in any bulk to anyone other than small hire companies - who a good few of the jackets went to. The jackets arrive with House of Edgar labels on them. I bought 2 jackets from House of Edgar's retail store www.tartankilts.com last year. The Prince Charlie and the Crail set. They are the same jackets to the ones that we am selling. The majority of the jackets I process have House of Edgar labels on them.
I bought a Prince Charlie supplied from Scotweb also (as part of a package) and it was the exact same Prince Charlie. I will, however, remove Scotweb's name from the 'marketing'.

The image was gathered from a clan's website, as I wanted that specific tartan for the background. I wasnt aware that it was a Scotweb image, as it wasnt credited as such.
I don't have access to change the HTML for the website, but I will contact the person who does.

As far as removing 'errors', I was given information about the jackets and I'm working from this information. I do know for certain about two of the jackets, as they're widely available accross just about every decent kilt store in Scotland. I will question those with more authority than me on this, and confirm whether all of the jackets were made in Scotland.

[English Bloke]

Both the jackets I've got from Paul, a black PC and waistcoat and a charcoal crail and waistcoat were both made in Scotland.

[Nick Fiddes]

I'm sorry John but the description you were given is factually inaccurate. I've just been speaking a few minutes ago to the Sales Director of House of Edgar (who called me, having heard by another route) who confirms that they are most definitely not their jackets, which are not in fact made in Scotland so the published description simply cannot be true.

[Dougald]

Hi Paul,
Still no sign of my Argyll Jacket.
any chance of sendoing on the tracking number, and I can try to chase it down.
thanks,
Don

[NorCalPiper]

OK...So what exactly does this mean? These are not HoE jackets even though they say so?

[Danwell]

This thread has just been brought to my attention. I tried to PM Paul but his mailbox is full so my message won't send. And I don't know how to contact him otherwise. So here is the message I intended to send. I'd be grateful if anyone who can would bring it to his attention.

==

Hi Paul,

Someone on Xmarks brought your jacket site to my attention, where you are using our name in your marketing.

We were offered these ourselves and refused. They are most definitely NOT the same jackets as any we have ever sold on Scotweb. When we were shown them they were far from our quality standards in both materials and construction. And to say that they are Made in Scotland is factually misleading since we know they're imported from Eastern Europe.

Also, I notice the background tartan on your web site is one of our copyright images, used without our permission. I'd ask you please to remove that at the same time.

We could of course complain to Trading Standards or even take legal action. But I'd very much prefer to resolve this amicably. I'd also intend to publish a correction on XMarks and Brotherhood once the matter is resolved. But if you can remove our name and correct the factual errors in a timely fashion I shall of course do so politely.

Please confirm as soon as possible when this is done.

Thanks

Nick

This is the second message of this nature I've seen you post in recent history, and I've seem some of what you have written in the Scotweb dedicated forum in response to some of the complaints that have been made against your company.....

On a forum that seems to be inhabited mainly by genuine men with a love for kilts and who are indeed "gentlemen", why do you insist on posting these things publicly? A simple message on the board asking for the person involved to contact would more than surfice: there is never any need for threats of legal action or to try to muddy the name of someone like Paul as a way to appease your anger at an honest mistake. You accused Paul of false advertising and of theft on a public forum not too long after you accused Lady Christel of the same......that is very bad form!

You stand up indignantly when an issue is raised with your company and ask that it's resolved quietly in PM; why not try the same in any issue you have with others on this forum?

I'd like to see an apology made to Paul regarding you allegations and rudeness.

[Nick Fiddes]

Danwell, I'm sorry if you feel I've been rude. And I accept that it was an unfortunate coincidence that I found reason twice within a short space of time to use this forum to try to make contact about grievances publicly when other means failed. But...

Firstly, I did not accuse Lady Christel of false advertising. I noted factually that a commercial web site that I knew nothing of otherwise was using our property without permission, and that they had failed to respond to repeated efforts to contact them through their published contact details. With the help of community members, we resolved the situation without undue costs to either party, just as I hoped. And I made it clear here afterwards that the error seemed to be one of ignorance of proper image use procedures rather than deliberate theft. But the fact remains that I was put to much nuisance by someone else's failure to observe the law, and I fail to see why I should be blamed for taking what I saw as the most efficient route to protecting our legitimate interests.

As for Paul, I DID in fact try to PM him, as previously noted. But in any event it is now entirely clear that his jackets were not made by House of Edgar as he falsely claimed. HoE themselves confirm this and are equally outraged, and as I explained his description could not possibly be true. As a reasonably genuine man with a love of kilts myself (I leave it to others to judge whether I am a "gentleman") I believe people have a right to be protected from disinformation when they are being actively misled, and that this is a legitimate function of a forum such as this. And as Paul had for months been publicly accusing my company by name of a "rip-off" for our selling authentic Scottish-made jackets at a fair price by comparison with his wrongly described product, then no, I am in no mood to apologise.

[OC Richard]

As a disinterested bystander in all of this, I just wanted confirmation of what was implied, that there being sold, in Scotland, kilt jackets with House Of Edgar labels sewn in, which in fact were made in Eastern Europe.

As I worked for some time at a Highland outfitter which carried HOE jackets, I would immediately be able to tell such a counterfeit in person by the feel of the cloth and the details of the tailoring. But perhaps not so in a photo.

In any case it's an alarming story.

Years ago an aquaintance of mine was visiting Sialkot, Pakistan, and walked into a shop where bagpipes were being made and being stamped "RG HARDIE GLASGOW". I have since confirmed this, having seen a couple of these sets of pipes, sold in Scotland as Scottish-made pipes. That they are of non-Scottish manufacture is immediately obvious when you examine them in person.

[Danwell]

No, you didn't accuse Lady Christel of false advertising, but you did make an accusation of theft in a public forum.

What you did then, and what you've done here is a blatant and absolutely transparent attempt to create ill-feeling toward these people in a very small community. Any person with any semblance of integrity or who was genuinely a ting in good faith would have pursued these matters privately, NOT in a public forum.

If Paul made a claim as to the provenance of these jackets in good faith accepting the information of his suppliers the yes, he has beennegligent in checking and being certain. To accuse him of knowingly and willingly defrauding his customers with no grounds is disgusting and makes you no better than the person you claim he his.