Was Tartan ever actually banned?

[macwilkin]

I am glad we can debate these topics openly. I was not aware of your occupation specializing in Western History. I also agree that John Ford was brilliant at putting symbolism and allegory to film. I also see that we can reach the agreement that lack of proof is simply that, lack of. I did not once say that I agree that it happened prior to 1941, just that the possibility exists. Then again, the possibility exists for UFOs to land and come to said Kirkin O the Tartan, but it is highly unlikely. I am sorry if my sarcasm was offensive to you, as tone does not translate well to text, but sarcasm is considered friendly banter here in North Jersey, in fact it is one of our primary languages, along with spanish, polish, russian, etc. Also, I hope you can accept my future work in MLA with a slant toward APA. I work in healthcare, writing my own thoughts is difficult, it is much easier to site the work of others. Try reading any medical research, half of every sentence is a citation of someone else's work, who in turn cited someone else.

Apologies; I am the son of an Arizona father & Iowa mother. Sarcasm isn't as well known to those of us from west of the Mississippi River.

I do not require my students to use Chicago in my 100 and 200 level classes, as the majority of them will not be going on to be history majors, and MLA is much more prevalent in 100-level English classes. Your description of your citations sounds a lot like ours in history.

I use a number of Ford films in my class, including The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance and The Searchers. I also use Peckenpah's Junior Bonner as an allegory for the modern West, and I'm quite fond of The Shootist as well.

T.

[Kilted-Marine]

Ah, now I understand. We are discussing not just a kirkin of a tartan but a full blown orchestrated ceremony with three part harmony, a bagpiper, two choir boys, lit candles, and a formal march down the center of the Kirk, with flags held high and lots of tartan sashes openly displayed on wonderful preserved wooden staff.
Ya I doubt that happened in Scotland prior to 1940

I wish somebody had told me sooner

[macwilkin]

Ah, now I understand. We are discussing not just a kirkin of a tartan but a full blown orchestrated ceremony with three part harmony, a bagpiper, two choir boys, lit candles, and a formal march down the center of the Kirk, with flags held high and lots of tartan sashes openly displayed on wonderful preserved wooden staff.
Ya I doubt that happened in Scotland prior to 1940

I wish somebody had told me sooner

A Kirkin' of the Tartan is what the ceremony is normally called, Mark. As I mentioned earlier, "kirk" simply means "church", as in The Kirk, or the Church of Scotland. It's only through the ceremony that it has come to mean "the blessing" of the tartans, and thereby the clans/families they symbolize.

Again, I think your hypothetical example of an individual tartan being blessed might be possible, but not before the idea of a clan tartan became popular, and that certainly wasn't at the time the legend establishes it -- if we believe respected tartan scholars such as Newsome, Scarlett, MacDonald, Wilton, etc., then we can say that the concept of a tartan symbolizing an individual clan was not the established custom of the day during the Jacobite era, then that blows a major hole in the legend as promoted by many in the Diaspora community today.

One source that tends to support this is the observation of the Hon. Stuart Erskine in 1901 in his book The Kilt and How to Wear it. Erskine specifically notes that older Highland gentlemen "knew nothing" of clan tartans. Matt Newsome has an excellent article on Erskine here:

http://albanach.org/kiltandhowtowearit.htm

I'm hoping Matt will weigh in on this discussion soon.

Regards,

T.

[Kilted-Marine]

Beating a Dead Horse

[macwilkin]

Beating a Dead Horse

I'm sorry you feel that way, Mark. Again, no offense was ever intended.

T.

[Kilted-Marine]