Pronunciation of Chattan?

[piperdbh]

I was told once to never tell someone else how to say or spell his/her own name. As an educator, I've seen some very "creative" spellings.

I always assumed Chattan sounded like Chattanooga without the ooga. You learn something new every day!

[creagdhubh]

I was told once to never tell someone else how to say or spell his/her own name. As an educator, I've seen some very "creative" spellings.

I always assumed Chattan sounded like Chattanooga without the ooga. You learn something new every day!

Quite right mate! However, there is indeed a correct Scottish Gaelic pronunciation of the name Chattan, which I believe is what Rex was conveying.

Aye,

[bdkilted]

Interesting. The Keith's came for Chattam and we were told it was derived from the Catti celtic tribe from the low country that emigrated to Scotland during Malcohm I time. That said, we always pronouced it Cattam.

[ThistleDown]

Quite right mate! However, there is indeed a correct Scottish Gaelic pronunciation of the name Chattan, which I believe is what Rex was conveying.

Aye,

No, not quite, Kyle. What I said was that in Badenoch, Strathdearn and Strathnairn. the homelands of the Clanchattan, we pronounce it "khakh-tun" in the 21C. I'm not a Gaelic speaker and Gaelic has long ceased to be the language of the Central Highlands.

In another post to this thread: you are correct, Cluny pronounces it "hatton". I sit on the same Council of the Clanchattan. You may want to make note that The Mackintosh -- and others -- pronounce it "hatton", too All of us seek the easy road when we can.

Did you say that you were in Newtonmore earlier this month?

[ThistleDown]

Interesting. The Keith's came for Chattam and we were told it was derived from the Catti celtic tribe from the low country that emigrated to Scotland during Malcohm I time. That said, we always pronouced it Cattam.

Stay with The Keiths you have, bdk. There was a family by the name who were tenants at Dunachton a long ways back and, I suspect, were 'captured' by the sept rievers of the 19C; thereafter all of the name became Chattans, according to the plagiarising sept lists. Not true unless you can accurately trace your ancestry to that single family.

As for the tales of origin, it is most likely that the clanchattan descended of local (aboriginal) folk who attached themselves -- in Lochaber -- to an abbot of the old church who called himself Chattan. The other story, descent from the Cattii, is stretching credibility and time-lines to the limit.

That's Chattan with an "n" by the way, bdk, not an "m".

[creagdhubh]

No, not quite, Kyle. What I said was that in Badenoch, Strathdearn and Strathnairn. the homelands of the Clanchattan, we pronounce it "khakh-tun" in the 21C. I'm not a Gaelic speaker and Gaelic has long ceased to be the language of the Central Highlands.

In another post to this thread: you are correct, Cluny pronounces it "hatton". I sit on the same Council of the Clanchattan. You may want to make note that The Mackintosh -- and others -- pronounce it "hatton", too All of us seek the easy road when we can.

Did you say that you were in Newtonmore earlier this month?

I understand Rex, apologies mate. Yes, I was in Newtonmore, Kingussie, and Laggan for the Macpherson gathering and rally the first weekend of August. I then went south to Blairgowrie the Wednesday after the gathering for an informal luncheon at Cluny's residence, Newton Castle. I finished the rather brief trip (this time around-much to my chagrin and dismay) in Edinburgh-visiting relatives, friends, and attending the military tattoo/fringe events. Wish we could have met up and had a proper nip, not completely sure how you were doing, health-wise, and I did not want to intrude by asking. I'll be back next July, for about 3-4 weeks, much longer stay in 2011.

Cheers,

[creagdhubh]

Stay with The Keiths you have, bdk. There was a family by the name who were tenants at Dunachton a long ways back and, I suspect, were 'captured' by the sept rievers of the 19C; thereafter all of the name became Chattans, according to the plagiarising sept lists. Not true unless you can accurately trace your ancestry to that single family.

As for the tales of origin, it is most likely that the clanchattan descended of local (aboriginal) folk who attached themselves -- in Lochaber -- to an abbot of the old church who called himself Chattan. The other story, descent from the Cattii, is stretching credibility and time-lines to the limit.

That's Chattan with an "n" by the way, bdk, not an "m".

Quite right Rex, and correct me if I am wrong, but I believe the tribe of the Catti, originally came from the region in western Europe that is now the country of Germany.

[ThistleDown]

correct me if I am wrong, but I believe the tribe of the Catti, originally came from the region in western Europe that is now the country of Germany.

Yes, originally, but in the first century BCE at least a part of the German tribe moved from the east bank of the Main and settled in what is now Holland. Bdk is referring to the long tale that a detachment of the Hollander Catti bunch emigrated to Britain in the first century CE time of the mythic King Corbred II and settled in its far Northeast which they called after themselves, Caithness.

[bdkilted]

Right you are. That is exactly the story I was talking about. It is the verbal history of my clan, which our 11th chief confirmed.

[Mike_Oettle]

The various assertions on how to pronounce Chattan intrigued me because, since I speak Afrikaans and German (and a bit of Dutch) the guttural sound found in loch is very familiar to me.
There is a general English-speaking tendency to lose that sound wherever possible (it was part of Anglo-Saxon).
It is a dead give-away when an English-speaker tries to speak Afrikaans and gets the g-sound wrong (both g and ch have guttural pronunciations in Dutch and Afrikaans).
And in the wider world we come across people who rave over the “locks” of Scotland and, especially in the US, those who anglicise Hispanic names like Juan (Wan), Julio (Hoolio) and Mexico (Meksiko) where there properly are kh-sounds.
The public school-educated sons of Scottish lords and lairds also fall into this trap, so I am not surprised to learn that at least one claimant to the chiefship of Clan Chattan talks of Clan Hatton.
But I am happy to have my suspicions confirmed and to continue speaking of Clan Khattan.
Regards,
Mike