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  1. #21
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    rules vs. options

    Quote Originally Posted by davidlpope View Post
    <snip>
    The enemy of creativity is not rules, the enemy of creativity is a willingness to buy the cheaply made and shoddy products that the Highland dress market is currently flooded with.
    Quote Originally Posted by MacMillan of Rathdown View Post
    <snip>
    Erskine's message was simply this: a lack of wealth or social standing should not inhibit one from wearing Highland attire.
    Thanks to everyone for their thoughtful replies. I think the topic of freedom in THCD is an important one to discuss because focusing only on rules can seem a bit rigid. It's a tradition, not a uniform, right?

    If I'm understanding correctly, there is a great amount of individualization in THCD that can occur and much of it is in the details. Between the two quotes I've picked out above, however, I'm sensing a fruitful tension.

    For men just getting started with Highland attire, there is a not insignificant investment required. This investment is often thought of in monetary terms but I'm coming to realize that time and knowledge are perhaps more important.

    One could go in to a reputable purveyor of Highland attire, spend a large chuck of money, and still come out looking like a cookie-cutter kiltie. Or go to a discount kilt shop and come away with the same look, albeit with inferior quality goods.

    In order to really dress creatively, while respecting tradition, requires knowledge of both rules and areas of freedom. It then takes time to find alternatives to the "rented kilt" look that suit one's budget. If one has the coin, they can go for bespoke items and if one is on a more limited budget then maybe second hand or DIY kit might be better.
    Last edited by CMcG; 5th December 10 at 09:13 AM. Reason: added a word
    - Justitia et fortitudo invincibilia sunt
    - An t'arm breac dearg

  2. #22
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    CMcG, you've certainly hit the nail on the head. That's the real 'meat' of the issue when it comes to Highland attire, and (thankfully) there's a lot of room for individuality.

    To tie in Bugbear's question, here's the way I understand the whole issue of THCD. It is most definitely NOT Saxon-style dress, which tends toward the "plain and unadorned". If one wants to be plain and unadorned, the choice is simple: wear trousers! But the Highland tradition calls for a bit more show. And while there is a lot of leeway within THCD, one can indeed go "too far", by (as discussed in another thread) "overdoing the bling".

    Certainly there's nothing wrong, per se, by going with the rented-kilt look, where every part of one's attire is perfectly within the norm. It will still look ten times more interesting than a guy wearing trousers. But within the Highland manner of dress, even that is a bit hum-drum and plain. There's a lot of room for individuality and uniqueness and personal flair without going too far. And that, of course, is the subject of much discussion and disagreement. But it's also half the fun of wearing a kilt and being a part of this wonderful tradition!

    At the end of the day, though, I absolutely agree with you and cannot stress enough that we should all remember it's a tradition, not a uniform.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by CMcG View Post
    In order to really dress creatively, while respecting tradition, requires knowledge of both rules and areas of freedom. If one has the coin, they can go for bespoke items and if one is on a more limited budget then maybe second hand or DIY kit might be better.
    I think you have touched on something that, perhaps, explains why the Scots are more intuitive in their approach to Highland attire. It's down to the simple fact that most of us start out by wearing hand-me-downs. This practice is not limited to the socially or economically disadvantaged. For many years Prince Charles wore his grandfather's kilts. Even though he's out grown the kilts, he still wears his grandfather's sporran.

    The point I'm making is that when, as a child, one is given something to wear, one simply accepts his fate, suits up, and get's on with life. Eventually when the hand-me-downs are out grown, one tends to replace them with store bought goods of the same cut and style, simply because that is "the look" one is comfortable with. The result of this " kilted recycling" is that one learns, from day one, what to wear and how to wear it.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidlpope View Post
    I don't presume to put myself in this category, but it is a subject to which I've given some thought.





    The enemy of creativity is not rules, the enemy of creativity is a willingness to buy the cheaply made and shoddy products that the Highland dress market is currently flooded with.

    There is plenty of room for creativity and individuality. Creativity and individuality "live", though, in the small things that often get overlooked by new kilt-wearers. Almost every aspect of highland dress can be individualized.

    For example, how many folks do you know who, having bought a kilt, buy a black Argyll jacket with chrome-colored buttons to wear with? I know many. Now, there is a time and place for the black Argyll with chrome-colored buttons. How much better, though, to purchase a well-made kilt jacket in a nice patterned tweed which will be one of a kind? That's creative and individual!

    Consider kilt hose. How many folks buy a kilt and then make the "tartan sandwich", as Brooke has described it (white shirt, tartan kilt, white hose)? I know many. How much better to purchase a nice pair of hose in an interesting color? The salmon/pink hose that HG the Duke of Argyll wears may not be to your liking, but there's much room to be individual and creative: consider all the colors, patterned tops, handknit patterns, etc. available. For evening wear why settle for plain hose when there are Argyll and Diced hose available?

    Likewise, instead of buying one of the solid color neckties sold by the tartan mills in order to purposely match the colors in your tartan, why not choose a nice repp stripe, club, or foulard tie? The same goes for shirts- why not country checks, bengal stripes, blues and pinks, instead of plain old white?

    Or perhaps sporrans? Instead of the standard rabbit fur, chrome cantle "dress sporran" why not a traditional hair sporran or an animal mask? For daywear, why not a unique design in rich brown leather instead of the cheap black pasteboard variety that is often worn?

    In all these things there is plenty of room to be creative and show individual tastes while maintaining a very traditional appearance.

    Cordially,

    David
    Hear hear David, I completely agree with you!!!

  5. #25
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    I have enjoyed this topic immensely and agree with all of you - I especially liked Sandy's, Scott's, and David's comments. I feel fortunate to share your sentiments and approach to being traditional and creative with Highland attire. Well said gents, well said.

    Yours aye,

  6. #26
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    not that one is needed...

    But here is an analogy...

    We are dealing with something we might term Dinna Ken wha' or as our friend Robert calls it Je ne Sais Quoi....

    That is to say, there ARE obvious things one can change to make one's dress individual, but the better part is in subtlety and style. Sure, you can wear a red doublet or a tartan waistcoat where others wear black, but the style that distinguishes need not be obvious.

    Consider a room full of guys in navy blazers and khaki pants, or maybe navy blazers and grey flannels. If they are actually the exact same trousers and jackets, they may look very much alike, but if they are wearing the same COLOR jackets and trousers, the variation will be apparent, even if you can't quite put your finger on it- hence Dinna Ken. And what is so hard to put one's finger on is good tailoring, careful fitting, distinctive fabrics and the patina of age and quality. Look for the man who looks better than everybody else, even if he is dressed "the same" as everybody else.

    For some people, tailoring accentuates the physique. For others, it is camouflage. In either case, it takes into account the shape of the wearer, not just the shape of a pattern in a factory. It is always worth what it costs.

    Similarly, many of us can't afford to buy brand new, even off the rack brand new. A virtue of the necessity of cobbling together is the style that emerges from the process of tinkering and modifying and altering. I'd like to think that comes from paying attention, instead of just paying a lot of money.

    It certainly comes from the good advice and kind example of many people in this thread. Thanks.
    Some take the high road and some take the low road. Who's in the gutter? MacLowlife

  7. #27
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    I love this Thread.

    Thank you all !


    Best,

    Robert
    Robert Amyot-MacKinnon

  8. #28
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    In response to Tobus and MacLowlife; Just so it isn't misunderstood...

    I was not intending to say that you all should dress plainly and unadorned, or that there is anything wrong with Highland evening attire.

    I think it can be very attractive. I personally do not feel comfortable wearing all the silver buttons, chains, cantles and so on, so I have to keep separate in my mind, what I would feel comfortable wearing, and what might look good on other people.

    It's just not my way. It's also not my way to get bent out of shape if some other guest is dressed in some other way than I. Were I the host... That is who should be concerned about what the other guests are wearing.
    I tried to ask my inner curmudgeon before posting, but he sprayed me with the garden hose…
    Yes, I have squirrels in my brain…

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacLowlife View Post
    But here is an analogy...

    We are dealing with something we might term Dinna Ken wha' or as our friend Robert calls it Je ne Sais Quoi....

    Similarly, many of us can't afford to buy brand new, even off the rack brand new. A virtue of the necessity of cobbling together is the style that emerges from the process of tinkering and modifying and altering. I'd like to think that comes from paying attention, instead of just paying a lot of money.
    That's a very good point. The pics posted earlier illustrate it very well. The "PC" in the photo was fashioned from a used tailcoat. At a glance it looks like another PC but something is different, though it isn't immediately apparent. If the workmanship is good it is a one-of-a-kind peice that is unique in an understated way.

    I wish I had known what I know now when we had our wedding. I wore my kilt, but skipped the PC and went with an Argyle (a rental no less)in black with white shirt and black tie. It's the exact same one we see in every rental shop, almost every company website, etc. The whole kit looked good, but didn't look "like me." If I had it to do over I would have picked up a tux jacket or tailcoat and went to work on it adding all those details I've come to love.

    One thing that I also have noticed is that it's easy to spot the guys who are truly comfortable in a kilt--comfortable enough to "do their own thing". It took me wearing it frequently for months, as everyday clothing, before my own style started to show. In my case I had to get comfortable enough to see it as "just another article of clothing" before I could shake the idea that it has to be worn this way or that. Now I find myself mixing black and brown leathers(if HRH Prince Charles can do it, why can't I), wearing flashes or ties that aren't of a color in the tartan, wearing a grey jacket with the blue waistcoat I just got. My wife says I'm starting to look like I dress in the dark...after seeing a lot of pics, many being of royalty and aristocracy in Scotland(no offense intended), I take it as a compliment because that's what I though of them at first! I know better now--thanks in large part to the folks on this forum.

    That could be one of the things leading some to see the guidlines as chisled in stone rules. Those who only wear a kilt for special occasions often have one or two "outfits" that fit withing the confines of what is often preached as "proper" and haven't spent enough time between the apron and pleats to be comfortable breaking out of the mold. Others seem to see it as a sacred thing and hence it must be done in an almost ritualistic way. That is how they are comfortable doing it, and that's perfectly fine. I'm not a kilt-kop. I noticed a long time ago that even in a wall of black suits the guy who wears a unique tie and shirt stands out--not because it's flashy or bright, but because he looks (and is) comfortable enough to let his persona show through.
    The grass is greener on the other side of the fence...and it's usually greenest right above the septic tank.
    Allen

  10. #30
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    That could be one of the things leading some to see the guidlines as chisled in stone rules. Those who only wear a kilt for special occasions often have one or two "outfits" that fit withing the confines of what is often preached as "proper" and haven't spent enough time between the apron and pleats to be comfortable breaking out of the mold. Others seem to see it as a sacred thing and hence it must be done in an almost ritualistic way. That is how they are comfortable doing it, and that's perfectly fine. I'm not a kilt-kop. I noticed a long time ago that even in a wall of black suits the guy who wears a unique tie and shirt stands out--not because it's flashy or bright, but because he looks (and is) comfortable enough to let his persona show through.
    Ah, the old stereotype...those who only wear their kilts for "special occasions" are somehow not the kilties that the "full-timers" are.

    I've been wearing a kilt since I was 18. Just because I choose not to wear my Highland attire on a daily basis does not mean that I haven't spent enough time between apron and pleats to break the mold.

    If anything, I think those of us here who do not make a "cause" of kilts, save that of promoting tradition and heritage, are breaking the mold. I don't begrudge any FT-kiltie, but one doesn't have to make a daily thing of it to be a kiltie.

    Enough with the stereotyping...horses for courses and all that.

    T.

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