We are all kilted sinners! Oh no!! :-)

[English Bloke]

Post deleted by English Bloke

[Mike_Oettle]

Canuck in NI wrote: “The Wages of Kilts Is Death!”



There have been several references to what PiperDBH called “old King Jimmy's Bible”.
Many people still quote the King James Bible (or Authorised Version) because it is what they grew up with (I still have the AV that my grandmother gave me when I was confirmed).
It is also a translation that resonates with the English-speaking culture, partly because it has been around for so long, partly because it is very similar to Shakespearean language, partly because its meaning is very close to that of the original Hebrew, and partly because it is more familiar to most English-speakers than any particular modern translation.
This is not to say it is infallible. Its source texts have been shown to contain errors, which have been rectified in later translations through reference to older documents.
The OP is not alone, however, in believing it to be inerrant. Various sects put forward this belief.
Some of them place so much reliance on this claim that they are genuinely convinced of entirely false teachings.
Take this man’s preaching from whence it comes.
Regards,
Mike

[biblemonkey]

To reinject a little giggle worthiness, here is a direct quote from his erroneous supposition.

I've never seen a construction worker wearing a kilt. I've never seen a truck mechanic or a coal miner wearing a kilt. I only see men with clean jobs, or playing bagpipes, wearing kilts. Kilts are for men in the palace, not for John the Baptist type men ... real men!

I bet there are quite few rugged and ready types in kilts out there who would LOVE to make this guy's aquaintance.

Let's see, I know a 6'-6" construction worker who kilts on the job, we have here a number of highland games strong-men, some woodsmen and explorers of the wilderness, and last but not least, martial artists. Most of whom wear kilts during said activities. Manly enough for ya?

Hugh

P.S. Alan? You're right.

[Nighthawk]

So "soft raiment" being effeminate, if we just went back to the old-style "hard tartan" we'd be fine, hard being manly and all, right? If you've got your hard on instead of soft fabric, all's good!

...I have to ask... Was that a Fruedian slip or did you say it on purpose? Either way, I just about fell over laughing!

Hawk, nice to meet someone else who has a copy of Vines! Although you should check out the William Mounce dictionary, it's a little more up to date on a lot of the Greek. I also compliment your post, as a person who is pretty well versed in religious studies, I can see you put a lot of thought into it. I almost made a similar breakdown earlier in the thread, but I frankly, I didn't want to do so much typing!

I agree this thread is (or should be) more about the "fact vs faith" or "opinion based on scripture" aspect of Stewart's crazy website.

But to be clear, I didn't feel the need to weigh in further on the crazy website. Basically the only point I was making, was that I feel like some posts in the thread were singled out as problematic for the sole reason that they represented a, shall we say, minority viewpoint on this forum.

I don't like to seem as trying to get in a 'last word' but that will be it from me on the subject.

With that being the case, I misunderstood you! Stupid internet... So hard to get voice inflection!!

Let's see, I know a 6'-6" construction worker who kilts on the job, we have here a number of highland games strong-men, some woodsmen and explorers of the wilderness, and last but not least, martial artists. Most of whom wear kilts during said activities. Manly enough for ya?

Hugh

P.S. Alan? You're right.

I'm one of 'em... I fight with broadsword and backsword, and I study 2 Asian and one European style of martial arts.

[Steve Ashton]

Ladies and Gentlemen,

Could I ask a favor of all of our members please.
This thread has been, for the most part, a pleasant and thoughtful discussion. I have enjoyed the insights to each of your personalities.

But this thread has touched on some pretty sensitive topics among our membership. Please remember that our members come from every corner of the globe and span about every belief system. We have all agreed to respect our friends and stay focused on the thing which brought us all here, a love for the kilt.

I think by now everyone has had a chance to see this thread, to visit the site linked in the OP's post, and voice their thoughts. Is there anything further to add but building the articles visit count?

To avoid having this thread reported to the moderators again may I ask politely that we agree to let this thread go to thread heaven (or hell depending on your own belief). It will still be available in the archives where we can reference it the next time the subject is brought up. Where in the future we can remember it for the respectful discussion among friends that it has been so far.

[McClef]

Mod Hat off!

Here on X Marks there are people with religious beliefs and none.

It is not a debating forum for the existence or non-existence of any deities or of one religion being better than another one.

But members often do refer to the fact that they have or practice a faith simply as fact which is not a problem, especially when it is kilt-related.

Slippery slopes start when people want to argue about the merits of a faith or want to start an attack against one or to argue their own POV which has nothing to do with the context in which the faith was mentioned.

Just looks at how many thread problems resulted because the Pope wore a tartan designed by Matt Newsome to see what I mean.

The context in this thread is that a guy attacks kilts and those who wear them and claims a biblical justification for doing so.

So some of those who disagree with him ( and I guess it's all of us! ) have written that they do disagree and by one means or another say why they believe he is wrong. Some have used the same source from which he claims his justification (i.e. the Bible). It does not depend upon how one views it in terms of inspiration, it still exists as a work of literature and reference just as other books considered holy by various religions do. One does not have to believe or be an adherent to know the material within.

But to introduce arguments that are nothing to do with the matter in hand is where problems start. Introducing arguments about the number or non existence of God or gods is nothing to do with the terms of reference and take the thread off at a tangent that, even if we did not have Rule #5, create heat and get personal and make the thread unrecognisable from how it started.

An atheist who posted his photographs of the Little Clompington Humanist Association's annual Burns Supper and dinner dance would no doubt be just as upset if they were preached at and urged to repent and believe. The kilts and the haggis would be forgotten in the resulting furore.

Surely we are here to support and celebrate and defend the kilt and our enjoyment of wearing the kilt.

Whatever else we believe or do not believe.

The rules and principles seek to protect that, and to promote respect

And they are what Moderators (hat back on) have to sometimes enforce and remind people of.

[Frank McGrath]

Just another bible thumpin' moron that has no life. I know a guy that thinks the same way about my kilt. A lot of "Christians" read anything they want from the bible. The way I read mine, God loves us all. Period. We need more caring for one another and less hate. Pax

[Detroitpete]

I have--with honor and respect--wore a kilt to mass, church, synagogue, Korean Budhist meditation groups and dharma teachings, Wiccan circles, Native American rites, AME gospel concerts and an interfaith convention.

I will continue to wear the kilt in such a manner.

The person that wrote the ridiculous babblings cited by the OP, just proves that it doesn't take intelligence to post one's opinions on the internet.

Religious dogma aside, Stupid is as stupid does.

[kc8ufv]

So "soft raiment" being effeminate, if we just went back to the old-style "hard tartan" we'd be fine, hard being manly and all, right? If you've got your hard on instead of soft fabric, all's good!

I seem to recall seeing images of a stainless steel kilt. IIRC, it was an Alt.Kilt. You think that'd be acceptable?

[BoldHighlander]

I'm not trying pick on anyone, or promote anything, but this thread has motored along for 10 pages with many posters quoting the KJ bible or other holy works, and/or expressing their personal religious viewpoints. And like it or not, these discussions are still a taciturn promotion of those views. People talking about their faiths doesn't bother me at all, but I find it a little ironic that the concerns about "slippery slopes" and violating rule #5 only pop up after somebody talks about their lack of faith, and makes statements that relate to atheism. And believe me, there are posts by "non believers" on the first page, it's just that they generally don't "promote" their lack of belief.

'Z' -- given that both Steve & Trefor have spoken on the subject, I won't say much on the subject (as I don't wish to fan any potential flames), but since you singled out my comment...

My one concern was not that the post in question was from an atheist. I could care less rather your an atheist, pagan, Christian, etc, etc....it was rather the tone of the message and my concern that such a worthy & well conducted discussion could quickly spiral out of control and find itself closed. You've been around long enough, you know this could very well happen. So my "Uh-oh" moment was my attempt to remind us to stay the course. No other deep dark motive....nothing....honest.

Religious dogma aside, Stupid is as stupid does.

That says it all, doesn't it.